Seems like we've had many months, even years, of talk about the MN U18 boys. With winter tournaments and Midwest Regional League on the horizon, it will be interesting to see how all of the MN boys teams compete this club season.
Sure 8:47, lets have a separate blog for the 10 parents of U18 boys that are so delusional that they believe the soccer world revolves around their boys.
This thread is meant for all boys teams. Let's try to keep it civil. How about some insight to winter tournament plans for U15-18 boys. Did any teams get into Disney top flight?
MTA 93 Blue had good showing in two friendlies at Creighton two weeks ago. 3-1 win against Omaha FC U17s (NE state cup champs) and 1-0 loss against KC Wizards U18s (Academy team). Playing at CASL showcase in Raleigh NC Dec. 11-12. Elsewhere, Blackhawks U18s look to be loaded, while Blackhawks U17s have seen the great diaspora.
mnfutbol is the blogmaster. this is his/her personal blog and we are his/her guests. since it is his/her personal blog, they get to choose the topics and edit/delete any comments that they don't like.
no idea how to contact mnfutbol, but i've seen folks suggest topics and oftentimes see them fulfilled.
if you are unhappy with the content, then i would suggest you start your own blog as the more the merrier.
8. 17pm why be so negative ? U 18 boys premier teams should be some good soccer. Can you inform us of games you will be getting tickets for, maybe we can join you.
Lets get USA cup back to a top tournament.. I want to see EP and MTA 19's play Blackhawks, shattuck, and some other U18 teams. I would honestly drive to Blaine to watch MTA against blackhawks. That would be some good soccer.
Ok, Anon 2:06 is fishing guys. What U19 team is going to be scrimmage any one now? Most of those players are not in the TC, they are in college. So, let it go. I do know MTA U19 played the Blackhawks last year in a scrimmage, and it was just that a scrimmage. Nothing special.
11:47... No they didn't. No reason to make up things like that. MTA 19s did not play anyone from the 18s, last years 17s. Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it. Please say something if it is not true. Thank you
11:47... No they didn't. No reason to make up things like that. MTA 19s did not play anyone from the 18s, last years 17s. Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it. Please DON"T say something if it is not true. Thank you
Couple early season scrimmages at the U17 level have taken place. MTA blue beat SCV Celtic 2-0. MTA look very much in form early. Healthy Eric Miller makes a huge difference. MTA White played U16 Minneapolis United. Not sure of score. White looks very much improved. SCV Celtic beat Bloomington Premier 4-0. SCV has added a couple stronger players from outside the area to help with scoring. SCV and MTA Blue will be at Shattucks next weekend.
Anon 11:07 The 2009/10 MTA U19's are at college. Most if not all are Freshman at college. 2008/09 MTA U19's are at college too. (isn't made up and isn't a lie)
As my son is/was on the last years MTA U18's (this years MTA U19's), they did play the BHK last spring very earily outside. The most I remember about it was that it was cold. However your right, last years MTA U19's did not scrimmage any of the last years U18's or even last years U17's. I think last years U19 were in college. I don't think anyone was lying or making things up. But it does sound like someone needs to CALM DOWN.
BTW, luv "Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it." line.
ODP Rosters Announced Wednesday, Dec 9, 2009 9:45 AM ET THE U.S. YOUTH SOCCER ODP Boys Winter Interregional will begin Friday for the 1992 age group at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex in Wilson, N.C. The event is held in conjunction with the Men's College Cup in nearby Cary. From the 1992 Region II Roster: Frederick Neher Stillwater MN Brandon Wolf Rosemount MN
Ok,I don't know a lot about the age group, but I am a bit surprised that PY wasn't in the running for the 92 National team. With all his press recently (EPSN, Adidas) you would think he would be in the running. I'm sure the other two guys are great players but again, we heard nothing about them during high school. What up?
Neher is a goalie and that could be part of it, just a guess there and Wolf did not play high school soccer, he kicked for the Rosemount football team instead
Three players from the MTA U13 Boys team were invited the the ID2 National Camp in Frisco, TX. Sounds like that's a helluva nucleus for that young team.
Heard two of that "helluva nucleus" were coaches kids and caused quite a stir on the 13 team. Either way, they are a strong team. much more of an "academy" group, with the best players in the state. Maybe a few were passed up for those ID2 spots by self indulged parent/coaches?
MN boys are much stronger now then they were a couple of yrs ago. Several premier MRL teams, All doing well at high level tournaments, and represents well at regional!!! Go MN!
Can the academies entering into these tournaments? I don't think so. I haven't looked but I could be wrong. A couple of years ago MRL Leagues were alot tougher. When the academy were invented, the MRL declined significantly. You are playing the Magic, Socker and Scott Gallger seond teams. MRL is not was it was before the academies.
6:44 You are partially correct. The US Academy teams play in their own league setting.
The MRL Premier league is still much higher than the MN teams have been able to compete in the past. If you want to bash, just do it, but it appears that 12:07's cup is half full, and yours is empty.
MRL is still better competition than anything in MN, and worth the expense and time if your serious about soccer. Those same academies cannot play in their states cups either. So again winning your State Cup in IL or OH is like taking 3rd or 4th place. The top 10% is no longer in the MRL, Top flight tournaments, or State Cups. Thus making MN, IA, and WI teams seem more competitive in MRL & Regions. Why do you think MTA & SSM wanted to get into the academy system so bad?
So, is the glass half full or half empty. I say it exactly were it has been for the last 3-5 years, which was kind of my point. Before thumping yourselves on the back to hard, you should ask yourselves have we really advanced our development?
For those interested in US Soccer Development Academy, and its effect on regional competition.
The Academy is based upon birth year, and it is interesting to see the way teams are selected. For example, this year the academy years are 93 and 91 - this really means U17 and U19.
Now, in effect, we have some U17 teams that are affected more severely than others - those with strong 93 players as their driving force. For those who had a strong set of young 92s, though, they are still intact at U17.
For the 91 Academy teams, they are often filled with a number of 92 players as well - because many 91s are off at college. Overall, the standard of the 91 Academy teams is relatively lower than that of the 93s, because of the age of the players. Whether the Academy likes it or not, the older academy years will be not tremendously different from what many of us see at U18 - players have their college plans set, and their enthusiasm for pursuing youth soccer is sometimes lower than when they were younger - they are just riding out their time, trying to stay somewhat fit and have some fun.
Good turnout of college coaches down at the shattuck event. Standard of play was up and down. One U18 match in particular saw a mass exodus of coaches from the sideline within the first fifteen minutes, the standard was just not very good
Just got the best belly laugh of the season! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karim_Darbaki
Please note ..."2007 Mr. Soccer Award in the State in Minnesota for the U-16 age level." I never knew their was such a title? Anyone ever hear of this?
Rumor is SSM U17 lost to one of the MTA teams in a scrimmage, and the MTA team in question suddenly found themselves uninvited.
The weekend was all about showcasing SSM. What I wonder is how you look good smoking someone 6-0. I would think coaches would rather see players perform under actual game conditions.
Let me get this straight. SSM U17 lost to MTA U17 White. SSM says it was because they were missing alot of players. But instead of looking forward to redeeming themselves by playing them again, they uninvite the MTA U17 White from the college showcase. Then beat their opponents at the showcase 3-0, 6-0, 4-0. It sounds to me like SSM did not want any serious competition, they were looking for fluff. I just can't understand why no one respect SSM here in MN.
Where do you get your "information" saying they were uninvited ? Pure hyperbole on your part....answer me this now that Minn Thunder is no more, will MTA be going back to the Tsumani name or Wings ???
I always thought a hyperbole was an extravagant, over the top, statement not meant to be taken seriously. So...Anon 10:34, I like that you use unusual verbage, but perhaps you can explain what happen if the "information" is incorrect.
Your lame attempt at changing the topic to MTA club name only makes me think their is perhaps alot of truth to those rumors.
7:09pm...Well if MTA is content to let other clubs hold showcases for them, then you have alot more to complain about than making up stories about being "uninvited" bwahahahahaha
I love when people ask for proof on the blog. What no certified schedule, dated email, tape recording of a phone call. Get real.
I was surprised to hear that SSM was at Disney. I thought you had to win the State Cup in order to get into that tournament.
However, I did check it out. The Disney Tournament is pretty much letting anyone who has a buck in now days.
The U17 & U18 SSM boys are in Copa brackets (Showcase, Predator and then Copa) The U18 Boys played Carolonia Elite (National Ranked @ 193) and beat them 3-0, McLean YS (NR@ 74) and beat them 1-0, and will play Indian Harbor Beach (NR@86). SSM U18 are ranked 80th in the nation. The U17 who are the state cup winners and NR @ 38should be ticked about their bracket. They played Westin FC 92/93 (NR@113) and beat them 3-1. They will play Andromeda 93 (NR@134) and Middepath (NR@ 123). If you go by the rankings they should smoke everyone and look amazing just like they did at their college showcase.
Once upon a time to enter into the Disney Tournament you need to win your State Cup. There were around 48 to 60 teams in each age group. Disney now has 262 teams in each age group. Some teams that SSM are playing have are not even semi finalist in their State Cup. So, if you can explain their method of accepting teams other than cha-ching please do.
How could only State Cup winners have been accepted in the past with 48-60 teams showing up? Do you really believe that all State Cup winners applied? Get real, they take all the applications and try to pair them all up with what seems like logical pairings.
I promise you that if 16 C3 teams applied, they'd make a bracket for that. Don't kid yourself.
That being said, the quality of competition is what it is- like teams paired together. FYI- SSM teams get in to the big name tournaments based upon the accomplishments of the program (not just results, but the placement of valuable players into the Collegiate ranks). Say what you will, but there are exciting things happening in Faribault- whether you see what you believe are "quality Ws in the Win/Loss column" or not.
The bottom line is that Disney has greatly expanded the number of teams accepted into the event by adding additional "flights". It was at one time a very difficult event to get in but that has changed over the past few years as they added fields and decided to make it a big money maker. It's still good for Minnesota teams to go and get games in outdoors on full sized fields even if the quality of competition is suspect.
I would agree good things are happening in Fairbault. It called a great private high school education.
"not just results, but the placement of valuable players into the Collegiate ranks" Really, from the 08-09 teams who would that be? Should I also qualify valuable players playing in decent soccer programs. West Point is a quality school but their soccer program sucks.
You can't keep living off of one years sucess. Or wait is Fairbault on the three year plan like alot of high school programs.
Remember "there are exciting things happening in Faribault". MTA guy there are three 2009 SSM grads contributing to sucessful D1 soccer programs. Last year they "place" 10 players on D1 teams. Only 3 of those teams had winning records. Two of those 2009 "valuable players into the Collegiate ranks" were from Omaha, NE and one from Canada. The one valuable players from Omaha played for SSM one year and was going D1 before he showed up at SSM. Are there really exciting things happening in Fairbault? Yes, they are in a classroom.
MTA guy, I am not a MTA supporter. However SSM is right in that MTA is totally dropping the ball on the boys side of their program. Last year the U18 team beat SSM at State Cup. SSM sent 10 players to D1 schools. MTA sent one, he was a walk on. The MTA girls program indictates you know how to do it. So, what is the problem?
SSM is an exclusive boarding school that provides an amazing education. MTA is a great girls club. Anything beyond that is a reach.
One of the biggest problems for boy players in Minnesota is that so many of the talented kids don't have the grades to make it in college. Look at who the top kids were then look at their grades and ACT scores...it's pretty sad.
I would agree 100%! The biggest advantage SSM has is it is actively involved in making sure the boys are academically successful. Their players can miss a month of school attending CASL, Disney, Surf Cup, Dallas Cup, Adidas Blue Chip, ODP camps and tournaments as well as Midwest league and their teachers and coaches’ work with the players to make sure they are keeping current. I have spoken with several players and parents of players who say that does not happen in MN public schools. Why is this not issue for MTA girls program? Do the girls need to travel as much as the boys do?
The reality is that many of the top boy players in Minnesota come from disadvantaged and/or ethnic backgrounds and struggle with school and grades. It's not a bigoted slam and isn't a blanket statement, please notice I said "many". On the other hand the vast majority of the top girl players are your typical middle class suburban kid who has had the advantage of having support around them and does better with school and grades. I know some of you might feel this is sexist or racist but it's real world in the Minnesota soccer community. Check out the ODP lists for the older ages and it will for the most part prove my point. It is what it is.
9:21, The socio-economic and gender scenarios you describe are the reality across much of the country; yet, many areas of the country produce far larger numbers of Division 1 Men's soccer players. What is Minnesota missing with regard to serving the typical middle class suburban boy?
9:39, That's hard to figure out. To my knowledge all clubs treat the boys and girls players and teams the same. It could be that due to Title 9 girls know soccer has a lot of scholarship opportunities for them but boys (and their parents) know it's easier to get a hockey or football scholarship than a soccer scholarship especially if you're a good athlete and student. Can't think of any other reason because my son and daughter were treated equally well by their soccer club.
MN ppl do not need to complain about ODP, Minn gets more favoritsm thrown their way due to club connections and reg II connections. ODP is quite a joke and Mn takes advantage of it.
Brandon Wolf of Rosemount was listed on the 18 man all-star team from US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional. Congratulations to him for this great accomplishment!
US Youth Soccer today announced the All-Star Team from the recently completed US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex in Wilson, N.C. from November 27-29, 2009. The 18-man roster for the '92 All-Star Team was selected for their outstanding performance during the annual interregional event.
The annual event brings together the four US Youth Soccer ODP Boys Regional Teams for competition and player development. The event also creates an excellent opportunity for the nation's top colleges to preview the future of their respective programs.
The teams played matches Friday, November 27 through Sunday, November 29. The games were held in conjunction with the US Youth Soccer National League Boys games, also held at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex, as well as the NCAA Men's College Cup.
2009 US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional All-Stars
Region 1 Drew Hutchins, GK, Morrisville, Pa. Olutolani Ibikunle, Def., Wynnewood, Pa. David Barna, Def., Easton, Conn. Andrew Hartell, Mid., Virginia Beach, Va. Kofi Agyapong, For., North Salem, N.Y.
Region 2 Andy Holte, GK, Coralville, Iowa Andrew Farrell, Def., Louisville, Ky. Brandon Wolf, Def., Rosemount, Minn. Max Lachowecki, Mid., Evansville, Ind. Will Vitalis, For., Crestwood, Ky.
Region 3 Ryan Price, Def., Melbourne, Fla. Michael Derbecker, Mid., Carrollton, Ga. Stephen Roberson, Mid., Madison, Miss. Patrick Mullins, For., Metairie, La.
Region 4 Ethan Olson, Mid., Klamath Falls, Ore. Derek Boggs, Mid., Sandy, Utah Ian Ramos, For., Highland, Utah Karson Payton, For., Provo, Utah
not sure about the boys, but girls teams have been winning brackets for years.
try not to get too full of yourselves ssm folks, the lowest bracket and now no USSF academy teams. winning is always sweet, but it's sweeter when its mn state cup.
try not to get too full of yourselves ssm folks, the lowest bracket and now no USSF academy teams. winning is always sweet, but it's sweeter when its mn state cup.
There may have been USSF Academy clubs in the Disney showcase but I don't think the actual teams that participate in the Academy were allowed to compete. That was my understanding how the USSF Academy was supposed to work.
10:14...you are correct...the academy teams in the u-17 brackets only had their younger academy players playing...essentially u-16 versions..remember the ussf academy teams use fifa age (i.e. calendar year, not August 1)...anyway, SSM will be accepted into the Academy next season and will continue the excellent work that is being done down in Faribault..
11:08...just a hunch, but rumor has it that SSM is admitted--MTA is the sticking point (i.e. uncertainty with Thunder etc)...i dont have a dog in the fight, I live across the country but am seriously considering SSM for my son (he currently plays for an Academy club in Calif.)
thanks 11:23. in the spirit of complete and open information (not sure what SSM is telling you), please see the attached link with details regarding USSF's decision not to accept either team this year.
http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?s=ussf+academy
there are two articles from back in April that might be both insightful and informative.
USSF will admit both SSM and MTA together if and when they make the decision to add clubs from MN. Other Academy clubs will not travel to Minnesota just to play 1 game so they need 2 clubs with teams that can compete from U15-U18 as USSF will be expanding age groups in the future. The expense is too great for clubs to travel here for just 1 game. That was the information passed on to both MTA and SSM last spring.
So SSM program/teams with recruits from coast to coast in USA, players from Canada and the UK are bragging about beating teams who draw players from 1 metro area? They should win all their games handily against all typical United States club teams.
The reality is MTA people always have to moan, whine, complain about SSM. All they are really doing is making their displeasure with MTA very apparent.
12:30, Actually MTA doesn't really have an issue with SSM no matter what you think. MTA realizes that to get into USSF Academy they need SSM to be a strong program. USSF Academy has made it clear that they will not take just 1 team from Minnesota due to travel expenses. Other Academy clubs have made it clear they won't travel to Minnesota and incur all that expense for just 1 game each trip. When the time is right both SSM and MTA will join the USSF Academy simultaneously.
I've heard MTA coaches say that SSM has made them better. Based on State Cup results of the MTA boys one could say that is true especially the way their younger teams have improved. But I think SSM will continue to pull a few of MTA's top players from each age group as they've been doing with scholarship offers. Whatever works best for the player and family is OK by me.
I have couple of problems with SSM. However, my main problem with them is they participate in the MN ODP programs. Many of their players have not and cannot make their home states ODP programs but come and participate in MN ODP taking opportunities away from MN players. Part of the ODP experience is exposing player to higher level coaching and competition. If SSM becomes a USSF Academy it will somewhat limit this problem. Yes, yes I know the rules say they can participate. Nevertheless, as with many things in life just because you can doesn’t mean you should. Especially if they are claiming, they are making MN soccer better.
Has SSM made MTA boys stronger, or even MN stronger? Reviewing their performances, since their inception I do not think there is much proof of that. In 2008, they enter the State Cup with one team. SSM pulled several players from VLY, that year’s current State Cup Champion team, thus destroying there competition before even before stepping on the pitch. I do not think you could hardly say they made anyone in MN better that year, other than a few boys that were from MN playing for SSM. Last year in 2009, they entered three boys’ teams. At U18, they did not make it out of their bracket and lost to a MTA team that had won their age group for years. At U17, probably the most fracture age group in the state; they were not able to make it out of their bracket. They were unable to get a wild card slot, and lost to BHK who lost in the semi finals. The U16 did win the State Cup, however, given that they have a great deal more training opportunities and competition opportunities from Oct to May than any of the MN teams, I would have expected them to. Nonetheless, they tied against the BLM C1 team in pool play. So, how has SSM made anyone in MN better? That was only looking at the boy’s side, on the girl’s side SSM looks even worse.
I do think they are one of the programs most coaches and DOC talk about when discussion the increasing cost of participation in youth soccer. How, the expense is keeping good athletes away from the game. So, are they helping soccer? Are they helping MN soccer? Are they making us better or limiting the pool of players that have the financial means to participate in youth soccer.
1. That's funny and awesome for Brandon Wolfe. He chose to play football this fall instead of soccer. That says something about high school soccer.
2. "Part of the ODP experience is exposing player to higher level coaching and competition." Sure, but the point of ODP is to find the next national team talent to develop a winning international team to win the World Cup. State lines mean nothing in the bigger picture. The better player should make the team.
3. SSM attracts many good players to MN. SSM makes MN better.
4. SSM players take ODP spots away from MN players. MN players should respond by working harder. SSM makes MN better.
I would say you could have various arguments about SSM and do they make MN better, when and if they continually win MN State Cup and advance out of regionals then maybe you can say that. As to them recruiting more MN players at least on the boys side I don't think that will happen, if you look at the current U17 team they have one MN player and I don't believe there are many on the U16 team either. They are still a young developing program so give them more time to make an impact. If they haven't made a larger impact once the program is 10 years old then to me it will be just another expensive boarding school.
Hey 2:13, you whiner, ODP is suppose to be about taking the best players to be exposed to higher level coaching and playing. Are you a tree hugging cry baby cuz your son didnt make ODP and you need a excuse to blame? Sure looks like it.
When are you going to get over this team must win win win stuff. Look at the placement of former Shattuck players both on the boys and girls side. Look at how they all did this past fall with their college teams?? Winning MN State Cup is peanuts compared to what they are all doing now. Get over this winning MN State Cup petty crap. Shattuck is about development, and from the short history that I have seen, they sure look like they are doing a great job of it!!
they why have they gone to such lengths over the last few years to be eligible for the lowly MN State Cup? could it be that winning state cup makes them more attractive for potential recruits? don't kid yourself 10:14, it's a business just like any school or other soccer club. $30k per year for some kids to get a D1.......parents could have saved that and spend $30k per year and paid for their kids to go to the same college. by the way, who are all these SSM college players other than Burbury?
great post from the college thread regarding the SSM "successes".
Bored in a snowstorm
SSM made sure we all knew they had 10 players going to D1 programs. So, because I am bored in a snow storm I thought I look up on the web how they did. Here are their college overall win lose stats.
W - L - T 1 - 13 -1 2 - 13 -2 12 - 5 -2 Missouri State 15 - 7 -0 St. Louis 7 - 9 -1 1 - 10 -5 3 - 13 -2 14 - 3 -2 Butler 9 - 5 -4 Lehigh 12 - 5 -2 Missouri State I only listed the names of the schools that had winning records.
Footballer 1) Spot on! Can't disagree with that at all!
2) If a SSM player is on the Regionals team or has been to a hold over camp, yeah put him on the MN ODP team if they must. However, if not why should we want to give an opportunity to some player from another state if we have enough players from this state to fill the spots.
3) They attract good players to MN thus making MN better? If they were attracting better shouldn't they be beating MN teams on neutral ground? Let say like at State Cup? Thus far they have only done that when they take the best MN players with them.
4) SSM makes MN better by taking MN players spots on the MN ODP team. MN players should work harder? While a SSM player is catered to, with tutors, walking distance training facilities, athletic trainters. MN players work Pt jobs, struggle for indoor training and spend hours on the road, have public school teacher who barely know their names and their athlete trainers are if they are lucky enough to have health care. But you say they should work harder? It would seem to me they work plenty hard.
Something else to think about. Many on here keep saying SSM players are better than the MN players. But yet they have problems proving it on the pitch. Must be a coaching problem then huh?
W - L - T 1 - 13 -1 2 - 13 -2 12 - 5 -2 Missouri State 15 - 7 -0 St. Louis 7 - 9 -1 1 - 10 -5 3 - 13 -2 14 - 3 -2 Butler 9 - 5 -4 Lehigh 12 - 5 -2 Missouri State I only listed the names of the schools that had winning records.
UNBELIEVABLE!! but if you must, Akron,undeafted season, played for the Natl Championship, UCLA, 21-2-1, played in Final Four, both players from SSM starting, I didnt see those 2 programs listed on your list. Now, to be fair, list those players from MTA and or MN in general and the win loss records.
Lets see Akron had one SSM player, not 10 % sure but I don't believe he attended SSM all 4 years, was actually playing in Regionals with Apple Valley before SSM and a damn good chance he would be D1 with out Shattuck. Can't speak for the UCLA player though, not sure how long at SSM and would it have made a difference.
So don't go nuts on SSM as the answer to MN soccer, yes they have decent players and excellent facilities, but for as much time as they spend training and playing they should be more dominant than they are.
Here is the one of their sucessful players college rosters Bio: High School: Named team's 2008 Soccer Player of the Year...helped Pius High School in Lincoln, Neb., to a state runner-up finish in 2007...named to the 2007 All-Cty and All-State teams in Nebraska.
Club: Member of the 2007 and 2008 ODP Region II Team...2007-08 U. S. Youth Soccer ODP Super Group...2008 U. S. Club Soccer Regional Champions...Arsenal Club State Champions, 2004-07.
Wow! I guess he didn't think SSM did much for him the one year he was there. However, I do beleive he was one of those sucessful 3 out of 10 SSM likes to take credit for.
But list the players from MTA/MN and where they attended and records since you brought in the W/L thing. Lets be fair and compare apples to apples.
MMMMM, I dont think SSM had soccer when TB was younger, if so, Im sure the parents would of had him there since the Father is a X-Pro and knows the difference. UCLA player was there since Freshman yr. In my opinion, yes both players would of went onto D1, but, would they have gone to the schools they went too?? No one can answer that one. I think Shattuck is doing just fine with development. Someone posted a few back about MN players working etc...I didnt know it was so easy to not look for better??
Bagnall, Olivia M Lakeville, MN MINNESOTA Cammon, CoCo D Plymouth, MN BALL STATE Crocker, Kelsey D Eden Prairie, MN CREIGHTON Crowell, Megan M Minnetonka, MN CORNELL Finsand, Meredith M Edina, MN NORTHWESTERN Flaherty, Kelsey M Shoreview, MN UW-GREEN BAY Gilbert, Nia D Golden Valley, MN NORTHERN ILLINOIS Gleich, Kelsey M Cottage Grove, MN CLARKE COLLEGE Godfrey, Devahn F St. Paul, MN UW-GREEN BAY Hoaglin, Rachel M Lakeville, MN VALPARAISO Jancik, Margie M Inver Grove Heights, MN UW-GREEN BAY Koller, Alex D Bloomington, MN ILLINOIS STATE Marier, Delaney D Hastings, MN SOUTH CAROLINA STATE North, Kelsey M Apple Valley, MN UW-GREEN BAY Nyblom, Christa F White Bear Lake, MN SOUTH DAKOTA STATE Phillips, Allie M Vadnais Heights, MN MINNESOTA Price, Marissa M Apple Valley, MN MINNESOTA Reinhardt, Chelsea F Lakeville, MN NORTH DAKOTA STATE Rosenthal, Kelly F Brainerd, MN ILLINOIS STATE Russell, Madeline M Lakeville, MN IOWA STATE Spicher, Allison GK Eden Prairie, MN UW-MILWAUKEE Stapf, Sheri D Lakeville, MN NORTH DAKOTA Sturchio, Jennifer GK Rochester, MN UW-GREEN BAY Westlund, Briana D Cottage Grove, MN NORTHWESTERN Dooher, Nicole F New Hope, MN UW-GREEN BAY Ballon, Rhaya M Rogers, MN NORTH DAKOTA Brandt, Stephanie F Rochester, MN MINNESOTA Debelak, Aliena GK New Brighton, MN UW-GREEN BAY Grandas, Bridget D Woodbury, MN IOWA STATE Somers, Lauren M Bloomington, MN UW-GREEN BAY Clark, Mikayla M Eden Prairie, MN UW-GREEN BAY
"Someone posted a few back about MN players working etc...I didnt know it was so easy to not look for better" Huh? Not look better. So far I think they have look better. Their record on the field proves it. SSM provides great education. Which is why they are able to place their players on D1 teams. Are their players better soccer players or better students. I would say from all indication they are better students.
Being fair. Stats from last years MN players. @ D1 7-4-5 4-12-1 @ NAIA D1 16-4-3 @ Nationals 6-11-2 @ D2 8-7-2 16-3-3 Final Four 23-1-0 National Champions @ D3 13-5-2 13-8-1 10-7-2 13-5-2 8-8-1 @ NJCC 14-3-0 20-3-0 @ Nationals 15-6-1
Most of these programs are not D1. To be on a D1 team you must be a good student. Most of the MN the boys have problems with academics, and many of them were unable to academically play D1. However I suspect many of these teams can and would be the D1 schools with records like 1-13-1. SSM provides not the best training in MN but the best education in MN, is all this proves.
lol at all of this....thank god matthew stafford went to geogia and percy harvin went to florida or they never would have made it into the nfl. seriously you can't make this stuff up. kids train to be soccer players from the age they are 5-6. what i will pat ssm on the back for is the exposure that they get from a college recruiting standpoint which is a big part of what mom and dad are paying for.
I think there are two questions that are key, and we can only find one answer through research.
1) How much playing time are the SSM vs. MN players getting. Anyone can be a training dummy, I don't care if you are a walk on for North Carolina- do you contribute?
2) What percentage of scholarship did the kid get when showing up as a freshman? This is the point that no one will ever know the complete truth about.
I challenge someone with more time than I have to find the answer to #1.
I wouldn't say the best - they have the most consistent and train more - atleast once a day - Remember what mama always told you. "Practice makes perfect."
Ok I have way too much time on my hands. But I took up the #1 challenge. Some interesting web sites. Some school don't list GP/GS in stats. Some schools don't have kids on roster, but they never play which I then considered them to be on reserve. Some I know were redshirted and listed those also.
SSM 09 Grads PI Div College GR GP/GS JS Canada U of Lethbridge 12-7-5 Not available KG D1 U of Pittsburg 2-13-2 Not available FC D1 Missouri State 12-5-2 19-19 JB D1 St. Louis 15-7-0 13-11 AH D1 U of Buffalo 7-9-1 17-15 LS ? ? ? Not playing? RV D1 Loyola Marymount Not playing KA D1 UW Milwaukee 3-13-2 12-9 JC D1 Butler 14-3-2 19-14 SR D3 Luther College 7-9-2 18-6 AD D1 Lehigh 9-5-4 18-15 FC D1 UIC 6-6-7 Reserves TB D1 West Point 1-13-1 13-7 EM D1 Missouri State 12-5-2 19-0
Now the MN 09 Grads PI Div College GR GP/GS RA D3 San Cruz 13-5-2 20-20 SD D1 Columbia 4-12-1 1-0 CG D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 17-17 AG D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 17-11 TH D2 North Park (IL) 10-5-3 17-11 BK D1 Creighton 7-4-5 13-7 RM D2 U of Indianapolis 8-7-2 Redshirt HR NAIA D1 Hasting College 16-4-3 14-7 GS D3 Gustavus 9-6-3 8-0 JS D3 UW Oshkosh 13-4-2 5-0 JW D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 5-5 TJ D2 Fort Lewis 23-1-0 Reserves (team carried 6 GK) BS D2 Lewis College 16-3-3 Redshirt WB NCJC D1 Garden City 15-4-0 15- NA DF NCJC D1 Barton County 20-3-0 19-0 RG NCJC D1 Dakota County 15-6-1 19- na DS NCJC D1 Dakota County 15-6-1 19-na
Taking out the players not playing SSM Grads played in 66% of the games. MN Grad played in 70% of the games.
SSM Grads on a average had college game records of won 8.3 games, lost 7.9 games and tied 2.3 games. MN Grads on average won 11.5 games, lost 5.9 games and ties 1.7 games.
SSM Grads played in 66% of the games, MN Grads played in 70% of the games. Which maybe a meanless number, but because the GS number was missing so much I did not use it.
So, SSM has 14 players 12 played college soccer, 10 played D1, 2 played other divisions. MN had 17 players, 14 played, 2 played D1, 4 played D2, 6 D3, 1 NAIA, 4 NJCC.
Very impressive data collection. (Are those lists complete? I wouldn't know.)
So what I see, and what I'm not surprised by:
- over 75% of the SSM soccer grads played college soccer - less than 1% of the MN soccer grads played college soccer
Years back, I was an exchange student in Carolina. I tried out for a select training program. I was clearly top 20, but I was told I didn't even make the top 40 because I was Minnesotan. That sucked. I lost that entire year of training at my level because of my hometown.
In soccer utopia, the better player should make the team.
The list for SSM is complete and was pretty easy to figure out. The list for MN/MTA not quite so easy or easy to figure out, an may not be complete. None of those figures include Eden Prairie players, some of who were very good. I think there is one CDA player but missing the rest. The MTA players were listed on their web site, but I'm pretty sure it is not complete either.
Foot Baller how do you get 1% for MN? Are you taking the whole population of soccer players in MN verse the whole population of a college prep boarding school? Otherwise I would say 85% of SSM players are playing college soccer. 82% of the MTA players are playing college soccer (I am assuming they had a 18 player roster, 1 player graduates this year bring it down to 17) Of those 17, I could only find information on 15 of them, don't know who the other two are. Of those 15 one was red shirted, so I don't count him. I counted all the players that are rostered whether they played or not, as both SSM & MN would lose players stated to be playing college soccer. So...what was your point?
You were a exchange student in Carolina? Never heard of such a thing. I thought exchange students were generally from different countries, didn't realize the MN was considered a different country? Or were you a boarding school student in Carolina?
Say thanks to my car mechanic. Nothing like sitting in Caribou Coffee waiting for a car to get fix, between the caffeine and hour or so with nothing to do. That is what you get.
I don't think the stats show any of us something we didn't already know. SSM provides a great education, which in turn allows them the opportunities to play college soccer. MN public school/Club need to figure out how to get their players the same opportunities. They obviously have the talent.
Something I did notice while collecting stats. MN only has about five out of the 17 that were minority students. Therefore, that doesn't account for all of the discrepancy. I did notice that many of the MN players are going to excellent schools that just are not D1. Many of those schools have excellent soccer programs as well.
Something else I notice but have not mentioned until now, Samuel Asante the forward super star from the SSM National team is playing NAIA for Lindsay Wilson and only getting some playing time. Lends some credence that NAIA has some very good soccer programs gear for the international players.
What I've noticed for years and what is apparently again proven by those lists and numbers:
Given the quantity of soccer players in MN, not nearly enough of them are playing college soccer.
- There is a high percentage of SSM players playing college soccer. Good for them.
- There is a low percentage of MN players playing college soccer. Shame on that.
I think a lot of that is due to the UofM not having a NCAA Men's team which at least would introduce our youth to higher level college soccer. Shame on Title IX.
I believe the lack of a Gopher team and the apparent loss of the Thunder will kill what little hope there was for soccer in MN.
Footballer AGAIN, how are you getting your numbers? 85% and 1%??? First you cannot compare a state to a private prep school is like comparing apples to green beans. If you comparing MTA to SSM, 82% of MTA is playing college soccer and 85% of SSM is playing college soccer. If you’re saying that 85% of SSM is playing D1 soccer, you’re incorrect. Only 66% are playing D1 soccer. Granted compared to MTA who only has 11% playing D1 that does not look good. However as previously mention here that has more to do with academics than soccer ability. Those players were not recruited for their soccer skills; they were recruited for their academics. If you have good grades and are a premier player in MN you can probably play D1 soccer somewhere if you want. That is what SSM is proving.
this just in....... 85% of US Air Force graduates from last year are in flight school studying to be pilots less that 1% of all other engineering graduates are in flight school.
SSM recruits players from all across USA, Canada and even from Europe. It's hard to compare a school like that to clubs in Minnesota who get players from one metro area. It's apples and oranges. In reality SSM should beat every team they ever play from Minnesota whether it's boys or girls teams.
6:41, Seems that the truth and facts trouble you. SSM does recruit nation wide and internationally yet fails to consistently beat top clubs who recruit from a single metro area. Is it the coaching?
"In reality SSM should beat every team they ever play from Minnesota whether it's boys or girls teams."
One of the beauties of soccer is that any team can beat any other team on any given day. Leeds United beat Man U last weekend in the FA Cup. By your standard, Man U is an abject failure since Leeds is two leagues below the P.L.
If nothing else, having SSM around seems to motivate you. And I have no issues with that.
i always love the super late night posts when folks let down their guard and their true colors come out. "shut your pie hole"? what is this third grade?
8:21, We're not talking about professionals here. We're talking about a school that offers players scholarships worth $35K+ recruiting from coast to coast, in Canada and Europe competing against clubs who draw their players from a single metro area at best. They have many more players receiving D1 scholarships yet still don't sweep the State Cup championships. What's wrong with that program? Apples and oranges isn't even a good description. It would be like Eden Prairie HS football team playing against Alabama yet SSM struggles to beat the top clubs in Minnesota. I don't think the little general and his minions from SSM have much to brag about when it's put into perspective.
I think what most of this proves is that SSM is doing a good job educating some soccer players. MN/MTA seems to be doing a better job training their soccer players but is struggling to get their players the academics to make it to the next level.
I do agree with 9:32 post, comparing SSM loses to MTA at State Cup to Man U and Leeds is ridiculous. Leeds had everything to prove and was the underdog MTA has nothing to prove. If anything, SSM should be motivated to beat MTA. In the whole discussion I have never understood how SSM claims to be making MN better if they cannot beat their competition. If anything at this point, I would say that MN/MTA is making SSM better.
I honestly don't agree that education/academics has a huge impact on whether MN/MTA or SSM has greater D1 scholarship success (maybe a few kids). IMO, it has more to do with their setups. That's why kids go to SSM. It's one of the key things they brag about - so important it's one of the first pages in their soccer brochure. It's part of their full time coaches job descriptions and they work hard at contacting coaches and providing national exposure to their players. At MN/MTA, the coaches are part time and much of the responsibility and effort falls on the player and his family. So instead of a full-time coordinated team effort, it's more of a player here, player there hit-or-miss approach.
So, let me get this straight- some are arguing that SSM is a failure because they don't "sweep the State Cup championships", and yet admits that "They have many more players receiving D1 scholarships..."
Hmmm, let's take a moment to reflect on what the players/parents are at SSM for? Maybe (just maybe) they are there to gain whatever it takes to receive a D1 scholarship? Maybe, it is an opportunity to receive a quality education which financially they could not afford without soccer?
Can we at least agree that IF the motivations listed above are the reason a player goes to SSM, they are indeed NOT a failure? Maybe some are willing to let your child have the USYSA State Cup Champion patch in exchange for the other benefits which they deem more important?
Fact is, many SSM players were in quality programs prior to enrolling at SSM (some were even State Cup Champions before).
Minnesota soccer parents and players should be grateful for an academy like SSM close by. It gives us all opportunities to put our teams up against a very high level with players from across North America. I think the Minnesota teams appreciate that (and probably enjoy beating those teams). I was hopeful MTA would become something similar, but have instead created several teams at each level instead of focusing on one "elite" team. Their decision though.
However, what bothers me (and this is not SSM's fault) is that they have to participate in State Cup. Given the heightened advantage they have over the local clubs, it does make it exceedingly difficult for local clubs to win. With MRL spots and a chance to play at Regionals on the line, its an important title.
Again, not SSM's fault. They want to participate in MRL as well. As a coach who puts his team against SSM, would prefer they were doing something else beside a local tournament with kids from outside the state.
They have the right to attempt to compete within the USYS National Championship Series. The first step of which is each State's State Cup. If not MN State Cup, where would you have them compete?
SSM has not, to date, been taking State Cup titles in every age group they compete in. I don't see any real unfair advantage that they have. Even though they recruit from all over, they are typically not pulling the best players that the United States has to offer. They get what they get, and typically the talent is fairly representative of every average player in every geographic location.
Yes, in the past, they occasionally have hit the jackpot with players. No need to name them here- however what have they got right now? The talent level is watered down- there is no Bunbury, Cline, or others to take their place.
Current teams are filled with typical hard-working Joe's. If they succeed with what they currently have it is because of coaching and work ethic. That's all.
No more bitching about "they *SHOULD* win". Fact is they AREN'T pulling players that clubs like PDA, Eclipse, the Texans, and such would miss. Facts are facts. If you get beat by them, you didn't work hard enough.
7:55- It is difficult to get the high quality players. The blue chip players aren't normally just "born". Most are in a quality situation with home club which has afforded them to be in a position that they don't feel the need to move away from home for a residential program. It is not a flaw with SSM, it is really the nature of the beast (especially in America).
In other countries you can lure many great players from their homes in the hopes of a better life. Where SSM appeals to people is the situation where there is an above average player with aspirations of taking their game to the next level but has no good club situation near them to get there. THIS is the reason that you get average/above average players at SSM. The theory from both parents and coaching staff is that they can transform those average players into the "blue chippers". Hasn't happened yet, but especially in the girls' side there has been no consistency in coaching (4 coaches in three years for the current U17s?). Until they fix problems at the top of the program, this will continue. If in doubt, ask anyone who has kids in the program on the girls' side.
The problem for SSM is that in order for the program to work, it has to bring in revenue (it is after all a business). There are two ways they can bring in this revenue:
1) More players who require less financial aid- which is difficult because few people who can afford the $40k (including "activity fee") have children that can really assist the program.
2) More money from benefactors of the school. This is difficult because they are not challenging for National Championships within the first three/four years. This is the real route they need to pursue in order to gain the revenue they need to keep going.
So, again the facts are:
SSM does recruit from essentially the World- but are not getting the pick of the litter. It is real work to get a player to move away from home. What you end up with is a better than average team because of facilities and frequency of training.
SSM has to participate in MN State Cup because it is the entry point to the USYS National Championship Series. They have a legal right to participate in this series, so the real moral issue is people who try and keep them out (actual law says that they cannot be denied participation, it is not just policy).
Wow! My kid got a soccer scholorship and a state cup patch last year. That with the money we saved by not sending him to SSM, college is now completely paid for. Life is good.
SSM has a well-established hockey program that the SSM soccer program is trying to emulate. The hockey program sends a lot of kids to quality D1 schools.
But.... so does the MN high school system. It is regarded as the best US junior hockey state.
You guys are right it isn't the pinnacle of his life. The post was in response to Anon's 9:15 & 5:45 10/01/10 post. Please note in all of this I indicate him. In otherwords, he is paying for college, he has earned the state cup patch, he has earned his soccer scholorship and he is the one that will keep it. I'll not be keeping any soccer scholorships. Which is why it probably also won't be the pinnacle of his life.
SSM has every right and I don't think many actually are that upset about them being involved in the State Cup. Last year proved, that while they are competitive, so is the rest of MN.
My own personnel opinion is that if the SSM kids are not "blue chip" players or will not be making the regional pool, or have not made their own states ODP pool, they should not be place on MN ODP team. They can go thru the try outs, nothing saying they can't. As others here have labled them as marginal SSM players should not be taken over the marginal MN players. MN players will be going back to their home towns with the ODP experience and excitement while the SSM players will be going home to SC, IL, MI and those states will benefit from MN sacrifice. There nothing saying they can't go out for ODP, however their nothing saying we have to pick them. It is done throughout the country as someone else here already mentioned. It may not seem "fair" but life rarely is. If you are going to SSM and want to play on the MN ODP team you should be amongst the top 5 in the State to be safe or your familiy should be from MN and living in MN.
Also, if your focus is to get money for college do you really need to spend 40K a year to get a 25-30K year college education? Is it really about getting a college education or is about saying your playing D1 soccer. D1 soccer that looks maybe as good as any of the MIAC school. SSM parents you've obviously bought into the program and are hopefully happy with it. Understand thou that most of MN doesn't think that SSM is the answer to soccer in MN. SSM is a quality private boarding school that has a soccer and hockey program. Sending your son or daughter their will ensure they receive a quality education.
I have to agree with 8:31's post regarding SSM. I don't think that 1:33 has a clue how wrong they really are. I AM a parent of an SSM kid and nearly all my child's teammates come from a very similar income level as me- very middle of the road.
1:11 is errantly assuming that all kids at SSM are paying full tuition, when I would argue that most within the soccer program are not. So, for our family our expenditures have been well worth the scholarship which my child has earned.
1:27 both statements are true. Many did come from quality programs (win/loss wise). Just because a club has a good win/loss record doesn't mean it is the best place for development. I would argue that even though SSM doesn't typically have a stellar W/L record, the development and future of these players/students is very bright. That, my friends, is development.
Do I care if my kid's team wins State Cup? It would be nice, but I won't consider her time a failure if they don't win one. She left a perennial State Cup Champion team, that isn't important. NICE, but not important.
ODP- what can I say about that? My kid was on "our" State ODP team. She went to SSM only to be dumped immediately by her State team. Went from starter to not making the State pool. In three weeks time. Why? Because "she isn't here to train with the team". So, she is allowed to try out for MN ODP because she is IN Minnesota. If the players were 18, they could legally vote in MN elections. It is about the best, not the best of the rest. Either way, it makes no difference. If you don't like the eligibility rules contact USYS, state your case, and see if you can get it changed.
Anyone know anything about the Kings FC? I heard the tryout was a joke with a whole bunch of high school junior varsity talent. Do kids not want to play for free at the closest level to professional soccer?
I'm not sure but I would guess that most average joes don't attend private boarding school. High school average joes have part time jobs, live at home and go to public school. While attending private boarding school you may not be the best at judging what an average joe is.
You posted last year about your daughter not making your state ODP pool because of her choice to attend SSM. She and you obviously decided that what SSM could provide was better than being on your states ODP team. It seems like she made a choice. SSM over ODP.
Who said anything about changing eligibility rules. Just like the coaches from your home state, MN ODP coaches can make their selection based on any criteria they want.
The 40K was something Anon 12/1/10 8:15 AM posted. From the post I would assume they too are a SSM parent. So, perhaps more parents are paying that 40K than you realize.
If you could post the date of the Anon post your referring to it would help all of us follow your point. I'm still trying to figure out what 8:31 said.
10:25- It doesn't seem fair that to try and better her self, she had to give up another great program where she was doing well? But, it is what it is and she made the right decision.
I am not sure that you are entirely correct that MN ODP coaches can make their selection based on any criteria they want, I don't think it is in the intent of the ODP program to exclude based upon where the player's parents live. Much like it would be wrong to exclude based upon skin color, ethnic origin, or economic status. Or are you saying it is alright to discriminate in certain circumstances?
Remember, ODP is supposed to be about identifying the best players for support of Regional and National Teams. If this is the case, regardless of any demographics live the best players should be part of the pool.
$40k is nearly correct for full tuition and activity fee. Most of us don't talk too much about what each of us are paying, but you can certainly tell if someone has the means to pay full tuition. Even if simply because we all know each other and what each's occupation is. Kind of a no-brainer, really. Wouldn't you think?
My kid did have a part-time job (bagging groceries and carrying them to your car), and did go to public school. We are the epitomy of average joe, and I'll stand up next to the typical Suburban-ite Twin City dweller. By definition, I am not sure many of you are making anywhere near the $39k or whatever the wikipedia says is the average joe's income.
I got the time wrong, it was 8:15 that I agreed with. It was a logical and accurate post.
ODP coaches obviously can make their selections based on whatever criteria they choose. Isn't that what your home town coaches did? Is it discrimination? I don't know, but when ODP coaches select an over abundance of players from their club, is that discrimination? Is it discrimination when an employer chooses an applicant who is from his alma mater? The players I'm talking about are the ones who will not be making the regional pool. They may not even be starters on the ODP team. For your daughter it sounds like she did make the right decision. If boundaries did not matter in ODP, I would think you could possible see the Wisconsin ODP team full of players from Illinois, Ohio South's team full of players from Ohio North and South and North Dakota full of players from Minnesota and Iowa. ODP has multiple objectives while identifying talent is one of the objectives; it is not the only objective goal.
I'm confused as to why you feel she needs the ODP program? Many MN players participate in MN ODP as means to be seen by college coaches. Something many here have already noted that boys in MN struggle with. It sounds to me like SSM is doing that for her already. Or is it something SSM pushes to help recruit more players? When I was at ODP camp not only did I see the SSM coaches recruiting heavily, but I saw the SSM players recruiting heavily. The average median income in 2007 was 50,000 a year. Our family income is 65K, with all of us working. Both of my son's soccer teams have players on them whose families make significant less than either of those numbers. What you are failing to understand is that she is no longer bagging groceries or going to public school. Thus she is no longer an average Joe. One of issues with private boarding schools and gated communities is they isolate students and families. Their perception of average American is far different than reality. You may feel you are average, but I strongly suspect your family has very little in common with the average Joe any more.
If they already had try outs it seems a bit premature? If they looking to get some of the college players to play for free, I think that could happen however I think they need to get the college players home in order to have a try outs. Give it time.
The stats about 09 MN Boys is so way off their are more than the 18 listed playing College Soccer, check out the rosters of University of Wisconsin, Superior, Waldorf College NAIA, Clarke College, Grand View College, Jamestown College, and the list goes on..........
592 comments:
1 – 200 of 592 Newer› Newest»we should keep this just for u 18 boys that way others dont have to grumble about us. please open a u8 thru u17 blog
Sure 8:47, lets have a separate blog for the 10 parents of U18 boys that are so delusional that they believe the soccer world revolves around their boys.
maybe we can even have a separate thread for the Valley parents and one for the SCV folks?
don't forget MTA
This thread is meant for all boys teams. Let's try to keep it civil. How about some insight to winter tournament plans for U15-18 boys. Did any teams get into Disney top flight?
Who runs this blog? Or is that a secret among a very few select soccer "geeks"?
MTA 93 Blue had good showing in two friendlies at Creighton two weeks ago. 3-1 win against Omaha FC U17s (NE state cup champs) and 1-0 loss against KC Wizards U18s (Academy team). Playing at CASL showcase in Raleigh NC Dec. 11-12. Elsewhere, Blackhawks U18s look to be loaded, while Blackhawks U17s have seen the great diaspora.
The only MN teams I see for the Disney Showcase boy's side are two SSM teams (U18 Copa and U17 Copa).
No response to 25/11/09 10:04 AM ?
mnfutbol is the blogmaster. this is his/her personal blog and we are his/her guests. since it is his/her personal blog, they get to choose the topics and edit/delete any comments that they don't like.
no idea how to contact mnfutbol, but i've seen folks suggest topics and oftentimes see them fulfilled.
if you are unhappy with the content, then i would suggest you start your own blog as the more the merrier.
Ok, mnfutbol
shattuck showcase has bhk scv and wsd 18s. Figures to be a good showcase in december
Oh ya, I'm going to get my ticket early for those games
8. 17pm why be so negative ?
U 18 boys premier teams should be some good soccer. Can you inform us of games you will be getting tickets for, maybe we can join you.
what is your problem??!!
Blackhawks are sick for that age.. I bet they kill everyone else this year. They got tons of talents fast africans and a bunch of new players.
Lets get USA cup back to a top tournament.. I want to see EP and MTA 19's play Blackhawks, shattuck, and some other U18 teams. I would honestly drive to Blaine to watch MTA against blackhawks. That would be some good soccer.
overRATED!
Who's overrated? 2:08
will bhks 18 ever win something?
Why talk about a team that has never won a thing, notta
bhks 5:56 PM
Ok, Anon 2:06 is fishing guys. What U19 team is going to be scrimmage any one now? Most of those players are not in the TC, they are in college. So, let it go. I do know MTA U19 played the Blackhawks last year in a scrimmage, and it was just that a scrimmage. Nothing special.
nice win by the SSM u-17's over the MTA u17 A team yesterday 3-0.
11:47... No they didn't. No reason to make up things like that. MTA 19s did not play anyone from the 18s, last years 17s. Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it. Please say something if it is not true. Thank you
11:47... No they didn't. No reason to make up things like that. MTA 19s did not play anyone from the 18s, last years 17s. Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it. Please DON"T say something if it is not true. Thank you
Couple early season scrimmages at the U17 level have taken place. MTA blue beat SCV Celtic 2-0. MTA look very much in form early. Healthy Eric Miller makes a huge difference. MTA White played U16 Minneapolis United. Not sure of score. White looks very much improved. SCV Celtic beat Bloomington Premier 4-0. SCV has added a couple stronger players from outside the area to help with scoring. SCV and MTA Blue will be at Shattucks next weekend.
Anon 11:07
The 2009/10 MTA U19's are at college. Most if not all are Freshman at college. 2008/09 MTA U19's are at college too. (isn't made up and isn't a lie)
As my son is/was on the last years MTA U18's (this years MTA U19's), they did play the BHK last spring very earily outside. The most I remember about it was that it was cold. However your right, last years MTA U19's did not scrimmage any of the last years U18's or even last years U17's. I think last years U19 were in college.
I don't think anyone was lying or making things up. But it does sound like someone needs to CALM DOWN.
BTW, luv "Just because you want to say something to make other people feel bad that doesn't mean you should do it." line.
ODP Rosters Announced
Wednesday, Dec 9, 2009 9:45 AM ET
THE U.S. YOUTH SOCCER ODP Boys Winter Interregional will begin Friday for the 1992 age group at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex in Wilson, N.C.
The event is held in conjunction with the Men's College Cup in nearby Cary.
From the 1992 Region II Roster:
Frederick Neher Stillwater MN
Brandon Wolf Rosemount MN
RZ, where are you?
RRRRRRRRRRRZZZZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!
MTA U17 White won 2-1 over SSM in early December scrimmage at SSM.
Ok,I don't know a lot about the age group, but I am a bit surprised that PY wasn't in the running for the 92 National team. With all his press recently (EPSN, Adidas) you would think he would be in the running. I'm sure the other two guys are great players but again, we heard nothing about them during high school. What up?
Neher is a goalie and that could be part of it, just a guess there and Wolf did not play high school soccer, he kicked for the Rosemount football team instead
Three players from the MTA U13 Boys team were invited the the ID2 National Camp in Frisco, TX.
Sounds like that's a helluva nucleus for that young team.
Bunbury on T playing for Akron.
SSM u-17 and 18's both with their groups at CASL Showcase.
Great Job !!!!
AFC U18's won its group at CASL as well (3 wins, no losses). Between them, good showing for MN
Heard two of that "helluva nucleus" were coaches kids and caused quite a stir on the 13 team. Either way, they are a strong team. much more of an "academy" group, with the best players in the state. Maybe a few were passed up for those ID2 spots by self indulged parent/coaches?
Wow! There 13 and it is starting already. Looks like we have the next group of psyco parents.
coaches kids or not, they are the best players on the team and one of them, the best player in the state for that age!
MN boys are much stronger now then they were a couple of yrs ago. Several premier MRL teams, All doing well at high level tournaments, and represents well at regional!!! Go MN!
Can the academies entering into these tournaments? I don't think so. I haven't looked but I could be wrong. A couple of years ago MRL Leagues were alot tougher. When the academy were invented, the MRL declined significantly. You are playing the Magic, Socker and Scott Gallger seond teams. MRL is not was it was before the academies.
6:46 Answer - yes Shattuck
6:44 You are partially correct. The US Academy teams play in their own league setting.
The MRL Premier league is still much higher than the MN teams have been able to compete in the past. If you want to bash, just do it, but it appears that 12:07's cup is half full, and yours is empty.
Is RZ still around?
Say what you will but the MRL Premier teams are mostly State Champs or Runner Up in their state. This to me is competition.
Which kids were invited to ID2?
MRL is still better competition than anything in MN, and worth the expense and time if your serious about soccer. Those same academies cannot play in their states cups either. So again winning your State Cup in IL or OH is like taking 3rd or 4th place. The top 10% is no longer in the MRL, Top flight tournaments, or State Cups. Thus making MN, IA, and WI teams seem more competitive in MRL & Regions. Why do you think MTA & SSM wanted to get into the academy system so bad?
So, is the glass half full or half empty. I say it exactly were it has been for the last 3-5 years, which was kind of my point. Before thumping yourselves on the back to hard, you should ask yourselves have we really advanced our development?
SSM Showcase up and running, lots of good games, put together really well and alot college coaches present.
any scores from ssm showcase
SSM u-17's boys won 4-0, 3-0 and 6-0.
The U-17 age is solid. Lots of good talent
The U-17 age is solid. Lots of good talent
Did the SSM U17's win State Cup last year?
they were the SSM u16's last year and, Yes, they won state cup....
RZ, where are you?
For those interested in US Soccer Development Academy, and its effect on regional competition.
The Academy is based upon birth year, and it is interesting to see the way teams are selected. For example, this year the academy years are 93 and 91 - this really means U17 and U19.
Now, in effect, we have some U17 teams that are affected more severely than others - those with strong 93 players as their driving force. For those who had a strong set of young 92s, though, they are still intact at U17.
For the 91 Academy teams, they are often filled with a number of 92 players as well - because many 91s are off at college. Overall, the standard of the 91 Academy teams is relatively lower than that of the 93s, because of the age of the players. Whether the Academy likes it or not, the older academy years will be not tremendously different from what many of us see at U18 - players have their college plans set, and their enthusiasm for pursuing youth soccer is sometimes lower than when they were younger - they are just riding out their time, trying to stay somewhat fit and have some fun.
Good turnout of college coaches down at the shattuck event. Standard of play was up and down. One U18 match in particular saw a mass exodus of coaches from the sideline within the first fifteen minutes, the standard was just not very good
Just got the best belly laugh of the season! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karim_Darbaki
Please note ..."2007 Mr. Soccer Award in the State in Minnesota for the U-16 age level." I never knew their was such a title? Anyone ever hear of this?
1:05: Sure! Mr. Darbaki has heard of it.
It's too bad the Shattuck U17 boys didn't invite anyone to play them that would give them any real good competition!
Who did the SSM 17's play?
Don't know but they beat them 4-0, 3-0, 6-0.
Rumor is SSM U17 lost to one of the MTA teams in a scrimmage, and the MTA team in question suddenly found themselves uninvited.
The weekend was all about showcasing SSM. What I wonder is how you look good smoking someone 6-0. I would think coaches would rather see players perform under actual game conditions.
Merry Christmas to all!!
yea SSM u17 lost 2-1 to the MTA u17 White
SSM lost to MTA White? Are you sure it wasn't MTA Blue?
Yes, SSM "u17's" lost to the MTA white team 2-1, alot of the u17 team WAS NOT THERE due to other school sponsored events going on at SSM -
So a number of u16's played up..hence it was a scrimmage -
The SSM u-17's also won their elite group at CASL.
Let me get this straight. SSM U17 lost to MTA U17 White. SSM says it was because they were missing alot of players. But instead of looking forward to redeeming themselves by playing them again, they uninvite the MTA U17 White from the college showcase. Then beat their opponents at the showcase 3-0, 6-0, 4-0. It sounds to me like SSM did not want any serious competition, they were looking for fluff. I just can't understand why no one respect SSM here in MN.
Where do you get your "information" saying they were uninvited ? Pure hyperbole on your part....answer me this now that Minn Thunder is no more, will MTA be going back to the Tsumani name or Wings ???
I've heard that MTA will continue to use the MTA name. Why bother changing and incur expense to change uniforms etc?
I always thought a hyperbole was an extravagant, over the top, statement not meant to be taken seriously. So...Anon 10:34, I like that you use unusual verbage, but perhaps you can explain what happen if the "information" is incorrect.
Your lame attempt at changing the topic to MTA club name only makes me think their is perhaps alot of truth to those rumors.
3:11pm....I thought the word was perfect due to you albeit lame attempts to stir the pot w/SSM....MTA supporters always seem to do this w/SSM...why ?
You still have not provided any proof of the MTA being "uninvited" to the SSM showcase...better why doesn't MTA conduct their own jr/sr showcase ?????
MTA holds a showcase for girls teams every year up in St Cloud.
Maybe they're content to let another club hold showcase for boys teams?
Is any of MTA boys teams down at Disney ???
7:09pm...Well if MTA is content to let other clubs hold showcases for them, then you have alot more to complain about than making up stories about being "uninvited" bwahahahahaha
9:01,
If SSM is losing to MTA White then they have a LOT of things to worry about it seems.
7:42 - SSM only MN teams there.
I love when people ask for proof on the blog. What no certified schedule, dated email, tape recording of a phone call. Get real.
I was surprised to hear that SSM was at Disney. I thought you had to win the State Cup in order to get into that tournament.
However, I did check it out. The Disney Tournament is pretty much letting anyone who has a buck in now days.
The U17 & U18 SSM boys are in Copa brackets (Showcase, Predator and then Copa) The U18 Boys played Carolonia Elite (National Ranked @ 193) and beat them 3-0, McLean YS (NR@ 74) and beat them 1-0, and will play Indian Harbor Beach (NR@86). SSM U18 are ranked 80th in the nation. The U17 who are the state cup winners and NR @ 38should be ticked about their bracket. They played Westin FC 92/93 (NR@113) and beat them 3-1. They will play Andromeda 93 (NR@134) and Middepath (NR@ 123). If you go by the rankings they should smoke everyone and look amazing just like they did at their college showcase.
1:22 PM
"The Disney Tournament is pretty much letting anyone who has a buck in now days" -- is that a fact or just your silly opinion?
Once upon a time to enter into the Disney Tournament you need to win your State Cup. There were around 48 to 60 teams in each age group. Disney now has 262 teams in each age group. Some teams that SSM are playing have are not even semi finalist in their State Cup. So, if you can explain their method of accepting teams other than cha-ching please do.
How could only State Cup winners have been accepted in the past with 48-60 teams showing up? Do you really believe that all State Cup winners applied? Get real, they take all the applications and try to pair them all up with what seems like logical pairings.
I promise you that if 16 C3 teams applied, they'd make a bracket for that. Don't kid yourself.
That being said, the quality of competition is what it is- like teams paired together. FYI- SSM teams get in to the big name tournaments based upon the accomplishments of the program (not just results, but the placement of valuable players into the Collegiate ranks). Say what you will, but there are exciting things happening in Faribault- whether you see what you believe are "quality Ws in the Win/Loss column" or not.
The bottom line is that Disney has greatly expanded the number of teams accepted into the event by adding additional "flights".
It was at one time a very difficult event to get in but that has changed over the past few years as they added fields and decided to make it a big money maker.
It's still good for Minnesota teams to go and get games in outdoors on full sized fields even if the quality of competition is suspect.
I would agree good things are happening in Fairbault. It called a great private high school education.
"not just results, but the placement of valuable players into the Collegiate ranks" Really, from the 08-09 teams who would that be? Should I also qualify valuable players playing in decent soccer programs. West Point is a quality school but their soccer program sucks.
You can't keep living off of one years sucess. Or wait is Fairbault on the three year plan like alot of high school programs.
I'm an MTA guy and know there are 2009 SSM grads contributing at good D1 colleges.
Remember "there are exciting things happening in Faribault". MTA guy there are three 2009 SSM grads contributing to sucessful D1 soccer programs. Last year they "place" 10 players on D1 teams. Only 3 of those teams had winning records. Two of those 2009 "valuable players into the Collegiate ranks" were from Omaha, NE and one from Canada. The one valuable players from Omaha played for SSM one year and was going D1 before he showed up at SSM. Are there really exciting things happening in Fairbault? Yes, they are in a classroom.
MTA guy, I am not a MTA supporter. However SSM is right in that MTA is totally dropping the ball on the boys side of their program. Last year the U18 team beat SSM at State Cup. SSM sent 10 players to D1 schools. MTA sent one, he was a walk on. The MTA girls program indictates you know how to do it. So, what is the problem?
SSM is an exclusive boarding school that provides an amazing education. MTA is a great girls club. Anything beyond that is a reach.
One of the biggest problems for boy players in Minnesota is that so many of the talented kids don't have the grades to make it in college. Look at who the top kids were then look at their grades and ACT scores...it's pretty sad.
I would agree 100%! The biggest advantage SSM has is it is actively involved in making sure the boys are academically successful. Their players can miss a month of school attending CASL, Disney, Surf Cup, Dallas Cup, Adidas Blue Chip, ODP camps and tournaments as well as Midwest league and their teachers and coaches’ work with the players to make sure they are keeping current. I have spoken with several players and parents of players who say that does not happen in MN public schools. Why is this not issue for MTA girls program? Do the girls need to travel as much as the boys do?
Why isn't MTA doing the same for the boys as the girls?
The reality is that many of the top boy players in Minnesota come from disadvantaged and/or ethnic backgrounds and struggle with school and grades. It's not a bigoted slam and isn't a blanket statement, please notice I said "many".
On the other hand the vast majority of the top girl players are your typical middle class suburban kid who has had the advantage of having support around them and does better with school and grades.
I know some of you might feel this is sexist or racist but it's real world in the Minnesota soccer community.
Check out the ODP lists for the older ages and it will for the most part prove my point.
It is what it is.
9:21, The socio-economic and gender scenarios you describe are the reality across much of the country; yet, many areas of the country produce far larger numbers of Division 1 Men's soccer players. What is Minnesota missing with regard to serving the typical middle class suburban boy?
9:39,
That's hard to figure out. To my knowledge all clubs treat the boys and girls players and teams the same.
It could be that due to Title 9 girls know soccer has a lot of scholarship opportunities for them but boys (and their parents) know it's easier to get a hockey or football scholarship than a soccer scholarship especially if you're a good athlete and student.
Can't think of any other reason because my son and daughter were treated equally well by their soccer club.
MN ppl do not need to complain about ODP, Minn gets more favoritsm thrown their way due to club connections and reg II connections. ODP is quite a joke and Mn takes advantage of it.
Brandon Wolf of Rosemount was listed on the 18 man all-star team from US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional. Congratulations to him for this great accomplishment!
US Youth Soccer today announced the All-Star Team from the recently completed US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex in Wilson, N.C. from November 27-29, 2009. The 18-man roster for the '92 All-Star Team was selected for their outstanding performance during the annual interregional event.
The annual event brings together the four US Youth Soccer ODP Boys Regional Teams for competition and player development. The event also creates an excellent opportunity for the nation's top colleges to preview the future of their respective programs.
The teams played matches Friday, November 27 through Sunday, November 29. The games were held in conjunction with the US Youth Soccer National League Boys games, also held at Wilson Gillette Soccer Complex, as well as the NCAA Men's College Cup.
2009 US Youth Soccer ODP Boys 1992 Winter Interregional All-Stars
Region 1
Drew Hutchins, GK, Morrisville, Pa.
Olutolani Ibikunle, Def., Wynnewood, Pa.
David Barna, Def., Easton, Conn.
Andrew Hartell, Mid., Virginia Beach, Va.
Kofi Agyapong, For., North Salem, N.Y.
Region 2
Andy Holte, GK, Coralville, Iowa
Andrew Farrell, Def., Louisville, Ky.
Brandon Wolf, Def., Rosemount, Minn.
Max Lachowecki, Mid., Evansville, Ind.
Will Vitalis, For., Crestwood, Ky.
Region 3
Ryan Price, Def., Melbourne, Fla.
Michael Derbecker, Mid., Carrollton, Ga.
Stephen Roberson, Mid., Madison, Miss.
Patrick Mullins, For., Metairie, La.
Region 4
Ethan Olson, Mid., Klamath Falls, Ore.
Derek Boggs, Mid., Sandy, Utah
Ian Ramos, For., Highland, Utah
Karson Payton, For., Provo, Utah
SSM u17 and 18's boys win championships at Disney.
Congrats to both teams.
FYI - you don't win "championships" at showcase events when there are 8 pools and 4 separate "final" games amongst the pool winners.
U don't play at Disney when ur sittin' at home complaining about SSM on this blog.
Can someone tell me if another MINUTE team has made it out of their bracket at Disney? I think SSM is the first
How did MTA do at Disney ?
not sure about the boys, but girls teams have been winning brackets for years.
try not to get too full of yourselves ssm folks, the lowest bracket and now no USSF academy teams.
winning is always sweet, but it's sweeter when its mn state cup.
The SSM u17's did win Mn state cup last year.
then you should be a proud ssm parent-9:14
try not to get too full of yourselves ssm folks, the lowest bracket and now no USSF academy teams.
winning is always sweet, but it's sweeter when its mn state cup.
There were academy teams in all brackets.
then you should be an even prouder ssm parent-7:57!
I would be if I was a SSM parent.
SSM moves up to 35th in the country from 128th. St. Croix still at 25th.
Is this the SSM team that lost to MTA White in recent scrimmage?
Has the SSM team played the MTA Blue team recently?
There may have been USSF Academy clubs in the Disney showcase but I don't think the actual teams that participate in the Academy were allowed to compete. That was my understanding how the USSF Academy was supposed to work.
10:14...you are correct...the academy teams in the u-17 brackets only had their younger academy players playing...essentially u-16 versions..remember the ussf academy teams use fifa age (i.e. calendar year, not August 1)...anyway, SSM will be accepted into the Academy next season and will continue the excellent work that is being done down in Faribault..
11:04 - I hope you are correct regarding USSF. What are you basing your comments on being that both MN entities were turned down this year?
11:08...just a hunch, but rumor has it that SSM is admitted--MTA is the sticking point (i.e. uncertainty with Thunder etc)...i dont have a dog in the fight, I live across the country but am seriously considering SSM for my son (he currently plays for an Academy club in Calif.)
thanks 11:23. in the spirit of complete and open information (not sure what SSM is telling you), please see the attached link with details regarding USSF's decision not to accept either team this year.
http://www.insidemnsoccer.com/?s=ussf+academy
there are two articles from back in April that might be both insightful and informative.
as is often said...."look before you leap".
USSF will admit both SSM and MTA together if and when they make the decision to add clubs from MN.
Other Academy clubs will not travel to Minnesota just to play 1 game so they need 2 clubs with teams that can compete from U15-U18 as USSF will be expanding age groups in the future.
The expense is too great for clubs to travel here for just 1 game.
That was the information passed on to both MTA and SSM last spring.
Anonymous said...
Is this the SSM team that lost to MTA White in recent scrimmage?
Has the SSM team played the MTA Blue team recently?
31/12/09 9:38 AM
9:38am - GET OVER YOURSELF .. it was a scrimmage w/most of the actual u17 not there.. but u need to hang ur hopes and dreams on something i guess. LOL
2:05,
And MTA white team had at least 3 starters at hockey tournaments.
That kinda stuff cuts both ways.
Guess we'll see how things go at State Cup.
2:34- what that shows is that the 2nd string of the U17 MTA white team can beat some resemblance of the SSM U16/U17 backups. Congratulations.
Who cares. SSM U17s lost to the MTA white team. Period. See you in the Spring, good luck and best of wishes to you and your team.
So SSM program/teams with recruits from coast to coast in USA, players from Canada and the UK are bragging about beating teams who draw players from 1 metro area?
They should win all their games handily against all typical United States club teams.
3:36 Thanks for completing the circle, we haven't had this discussion for a while...
4:14,
Just the reality of it all.
The reality is MTA people always have to moan, whine, complain about SSM. All they are really doing is making their displeasure with MTA very apparent.
12:30,
Actually MTA doesn't really have an issue with SSM no matter what you think.
MTA realizes that to get into USSF Academy they need SSM to be a strong program.
USSF Academy has made it clear that they will not take just 1 team from Minnesota due to travel expenses.
Other Academy clubs have made it clear they won't travel to Minnesota and incur all that expense for just 1 game each trip.
When the time is right both SSM and MTA will join the USSF Academy simultaneously.
I've heard MTA coaches say that SSM has made them better.
Based on State Cup results of the MTA boys one could say that is true especially the way their younger teams have improved.
But I think SSM will continue to pull a few of MTA's top players from each age group as they've been doing with scholarship offers.
Whatever works best for the player and family is OK by me.
I have couple of problems with SSM. However, my main problem with them is they participate in the MN ODP programs. Many of their players have not and cannot make their home states ODP programs but come and participate in MN ODP taking opportunities away from MN players. Part of the ODP experience is exposing player to higher level coaching and competition. If SSM becomes a USSF Academy it will somewhat limit this problem. Yes, yes I know the rules say they can participate. Nevertheless, as with many things in life just because you can doesn’t mean you should. Especially if they are claiming, they are making MN soccer better.
Has SSM made MTA boys stronger, or even MN stronger? Reviewing their performances, since their inception I do not think there is much proof of that. In 2008, they enter the State Cup with one team. SSM pulled several players from VLY, that year’s current State Cup Champion team, thus destroying there competition before even before stepping on the pitch. I do not think you could hardly say they made anyone in MN better that year, other than a few boys that were from MN playing for SSM. Last year in 2009, they entered three boys’ teams. At U18, they did not make it out of their bracket and lost to a MTA team that had won their age group for years. At U17, probably the most fracture age group in the state; they were not able to make it out of their bracket. They were unable to get a wild card slot, and lost to BHK who lost in the semi finals. The U16 did win the State Cup, however, given that they have a great deal more training opportunities and competition opportunities from Oct to May than any of the MN teams, I would have expected them to. Nonetheless, they tied against the BLM C1 team in pool play. So, how has SSM made anyone in MN better? That was only looking at the boy’s side, on the girl’s side SSM looks even worse.
I do think they are one of the programs most coaches and DOC talk about when discussion the increasing cost of participation in youth soccer. How, the expense is keeping good athletes away from the game. So, are they helping soccer? Are they helping MN soccer? Are they making us better or limiting the pool of players that have the financial means to participate in youth soccer.
Brandon Wolf,a defender from Rosemount, MN, was named a USYS Boys ODP 92 All Star @ the Winter Interregional.
1. That's funny and awesome for Brandon Wolfe. He chose to play football this fall instead of soccer. That says something about high school soccer.
2. "Part of the ODP experience is exposing player to higher level coaching and competition." Sure, but the point of ODP is to find the next national team talent to develop a winning international team to win the World Cup. State lines mean nothing in the bigger picture. The better player should make the team.
3. SSM attracts many good players to MN. SSM makes MN better.
4. SSM players take ODP spots away from MN players. MN players should respond by working harder. SSM makes MN better.
Do you mean SSM makes the state look better or MN players better?
I would say you could have various arguments about SSM and do they make MN better, when and if they continually win MN State Cup and advance out of regionals then maybe you can say that. As to them recruiting more MN players at least on the boys side I don't think that will happen, if you look at the current U17 team they have one MN player and I don't believe there are many on the U16 team either.
They are still a young developing program so give them more time to make an impact. If they haven't made a larger impact once the program is 10 years old then to me it will be just another expensive boarding school.
Hey 2:13, you whiner, ODP is suppose to be about taking the best players to be exposed to higher level coaching and playing. Are you a tree hugging cry baby cuz your son didnt make ODP and you need a excuse to blame? Sure looks like it.
When are you going to get over this team must win win win stuff. Look at the placement of former Shattuck players both on the boys and girls side. Look at how they all did this past fall with their college teams?? Winning MN State Cup is peanuts compared to what they are all doing now. Get over this winning MN State Cup petty crap. Shattuck is about development, and from the short history that I have seen, they sure look like they are doing a great job of it!!
they why have they gone to such lengths over the last few years to be eligible for the lowly MN State Cup? could it be that winning state cup makes them more attractive for potential recruits? don't kid yourself 10:14, it's a business just like any school or other soccer club. $30k per year for some kids to get a D1.......parents could have saved that and spend $30k per year and paid for their kids to go to the same college.
by the way, who are all these SSM college players other than Burbury?
great post from the college thread regarding the SSM "successes".
Bored in a snowstorm
SSM made sure we all knew they had 10 players going to D1 programs. So, because I am bored in a snow storm I thought I look up on the web how they did. Here are their college overall win lose stats.
W - L - T
1 - 13 -1
2 - 13 -2
12 - 5 -2 Missouri State
15 - 7 -0 St. Louis
7 - 9 -1
1 - 10 -5
3 - 13 -2
14 - 3 -2 Butler
9 - 5 -4 Lehigh
12 - 5 -2 Missouri State
I only listed the names of the schools that had winning records.
23/12/09 5:41 PM
Footballer
1) Spot on! Can't disagree with that at all!
2) If a SSM player is on the Regionals team or has been to a hold over camp, yeah put him on the MN ODP team if they must. However, if not why should we want to give an opportunity to some player from another state if we have enough players from this state to fill the spots.
3) They attract good players to MN thus making MN better? If they were attracting better shouldn't they be beating MN teams on neutral ground? Let say like at State Cup? Thus far they have only done that when they take the best MN players with them.
4) SSM makes MN better by taking MN players spots on the MN ODP team. MN players should work harder? While a SSM player is catered to, with tutors, walking distance training facilities, athletic trainters. MN players work Pt jobs, struggle for indoor training and spend hours on the road, have public school teacher who barely know their names and their athlete trainers are if they are lucky enough to have health care. But you say they should work harder? It would seem to me they work plenty hard.
Something else to think about. Many on here keep saying SSM players are better than the MN players. But yet they have problems proving it on the pitch. Must be a coaching problem then huh?
W - L - T
1 - 13 -1
2 - 13 -2
12 - 5 -2 Missouri State
15 - 7 -0 St. Louis
7 - 9 -1
1 - 10 -5
3 - 13 -2
14 - 3 -2 Butler
9 - 5 -4 Lehigh
12 - 5 -2 Missouri State
I only listed the names of the schools that had winning records.
UNBELIEVABLE!! but if you must,
Akron,undeafted season, played for the Natl Championship, UCLA, 21-2-1, played in Final Four, both players from SSM starting, I didnt see those 2 programs listed on your list. Now, to be fair, list those players from MTA and or MN in general and the win loss records.
it's like shooting in a barrel to get the ssm folks riled up. almost too easy.
Lets see Akron had one SSM player, not 10 % sure but I don't believe he attended SSM all 4 years, was actually playing in Regionals with Apple Valley before SSM and a damn good chance he would be D1 with out Shattuck.
Can't speak for the UCLA player though, not sure how long at SSM and would it have made a difference.
So don't go nuts on SSM as the answer to MN soccer, yes they have decent players and excellent facilities, but for as much time as they spend training and playing they should be more dominant than they are.
Just my opinion.
Here is the one of their sucessful players college rosters Bio: High School: Named team's 2008 Soccer Player of the Year...helped Pius High School in Lincoln, Neb., to a state runner-up finish in 2007...named to the 2007 All-Cty and All-State teams in Nebraska.
Club: Member of the 2007 and 2008 ODP Region II Team...2007-08 U. S. Youth Soccer ODP Super Group...2008 U. S. Club Soccer Regional Champions...Arsenal Club State Champions, 2004-07.
Wow! I guess he didn't think SSM did much for him the one year he was there. However, I do beleive he was one of those sucessful 3 out of 10 SSM likes to take credit for.
But list the players from MTA/MN and where they attended and records since you brought in the W/L thing. Lets be fair and compare apples to apples.
MMMMM, I dont think SSM had soccer when TB was younger, if so, Im sure the parents would of had him there since the Father is a X-Pro and knows the difference. UCLA player was there since Freshman yr. In my opinion, yes both players would of went onto D1, but, would they have gone to the schools they went too?? No one can answer that one. I think Shattuck is doing just fine with development. Someone posted a few back about MN players working etc...I didnt know it was so easy to not look for better??
just last year on the girls side.
Bagnall, Olivia M Lakeville, MN MINNESOTA
Cammon, CoCo D Plymouth, MN BALL STATE
Crocker, Kelsey D Eden Prairie, MN CREIGHTON
Crowell, Megan M Minnetonka, MN CORNELL
Finsand, Meredith M Edina, MN NORTHWESTERN
Flaherty, Kelsey M Shoreview, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Gilbert, Nia D Golden Valley, MN NORTHERN ILLINOIS
Gleich, Kelsey M Cottage Grove, MN CLARKE COLLEGE
Godfrey, Devahn F St. Paul, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Hoaglin, Rachel M Lakeville, MN VALPARAISO
Jancik, Margie M Inver Grove Heights, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Koller, Alex D Bloomington, MN ILLINOIS STATE
Marier, Delaney D Hastings, MN SOUTH CAROLINA STATE
North, Kelsey M Apple Valley, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Nyblom, Christa F White Bear Lake, MN SOUTH DAKOTA STATE
Phillips, Allie M Vadnais Heights, MN MINNESOTA
Price, Marissa M Apple Valley, MN MINNESOTA
Reinhardt, Chelsea F Lakeville, MN NORTH DAKOTA STATE
Rosenthal, Kelly F Brainerd, MN ILLINOIS STATE
Russell, Madeline M Lakeville, MN IOWA STATE
Spicher, Allison GK Eden Prairie, MN UW-MILWAUKEE
Stapf, Sheri D Lakeville, MN NORTH DAKOTA
Sturchio, Jennifer GK Rochester, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Westlund, Briana D Cottage Grove, MN NORTHWESTERN
Dooher, Nicole F New Hope, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Ballon, Rhaya M Rogers, MN NORTH DAKOTA
Brandt, Stephanie F Rochester, MN MINNESOTA
Debelak, Aliena GK New Brighton, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Grandas, Bridget D Woodbury, MN IOWA STATE
Somers, Lauren M Bloomington, MN UW-GREEN BAY
Clark, Mikayla M Eden Prairie, MN UW-GREEN BAY
"Someone posted a few back about MN players working etc...I didnt know it was so easy to not look for better" Huh? Not look better. So far I think they have look better. Their record on the field proves it. SSM provides great education. Which is why they are able to place their players on D1 teams. Are their players better soccer players or better students. I would say from all indication they are better students.
huh?
Someone posted a few back about MN players working etc...I didnt know it was so easy to not look for better?? From Anon 7/1/10 3:16 PM
That was my huh?
I think MN players are better players. They prove it on the field by beating SSM. SSM has better students. Not better soccer players.
SSM provides the best training in Minnesota.
Being fair. Stats from last years MN players.
@ D1
7-4-5
4-12-1
@ NAIA D1
16-4-3 @ Nationals
6-11-2
@ D2
8-7-2
16-3-3 Final Four
23-1-0 National Champions
@ D3
13-5-2
13-8-1
10-7-2
13-5-2
8-8-1
@ NJCC
14-3-0
20-3-0 @ Nationals
15-6-1
Most of these programs are not D1. To be on a D1 team you must be a good student. Most of the MN the boys have problems with academics, and many of them were unable to academically play D1. However I suspect many of these teams can and would be the D1 schools with records like 1-13-1. SSM provides not the best training in MN but the best education in MN, is all this proves.
lol at all of this....thank god matthew stafford went to geogia and percy harvin went to florida or they never would have made it into the nfl. seriously you can't make this stuff up. kids train to be soccer players from the age they are 5-6. what i will pat ssm on the back for is the exposure that they get from a college recruiting standpoint which is a big part of what mom and dad are paying for.
I think there are two questions that are key, and we can only find one answer through research.
1) How much playing time are the SSM vs. MN players getting. Anyone can be a training dummy, I don't care if you are a walk on for North Carolina- do you contribute?
2) What percentage of scholarship did the kid get when showing up as a freshman? This is the point that no one will ever know the complete truth about.
I challenge someone with more time than I have to find the answer to #1.
4:10pm
I wouldn't say the best - they have the most consistent and train more - atleast once a day - Remember what mama always told you. "Practice makes perfect."
Ok I have way too much time on my hands. But I took up the #1 challenge. Some interesting web sites. Some school don't list GP/GS in stats. Some schools don't have kids on roster, but they never play which I then considered them to be on reserve. Some I know were redshirted and listed those also.
SSM 09 Grads
PI Div College GR GP/GS
JS Canada U of Lethbridge 12-7-5 Not available
KG D1 U of Pittsburg 2-13-2 Not available
FC D1 Missouri State 12-5-2 19-19
JB D1 St. Louis 15-7-0 13-11
AH D1 U of Buffalo 7-9-1 17-15
LS ? ? ? Not playing?
RV D1 Loyola Marymount Not playing
KA D1 UW Milwaukee 3-13-2 12-9
JC D1 Butler 14-3-2 19-14
SR D3 Luther College 7-9-2 18-6
AD D1 Lehigh 9-5-4 18-15
FC D1 UIC 6-6-7 Reserves
TB D1 West Point 1-13-1 13-7
EM D1 Missouri State 12-5-2 19-0
Now the MN 09 Grads
PI Div College GR GP/GS
RA D3 San Cruz 13-5-2 20-20
SD D1 Columbia 4-12-1 1-0
CG D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 17-17
AG D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 17-11
TH D2 North Park (IL) 10-5-3 17-11
BK D1 Creighton 7-4-5 13-7
RM D2 U of Indianapolis 8-7-2 Redshirt
HR NAIA D1 Hasting College 16-4-3 14-7
GS D3 Gustavus 9-6-3 8-0
JS D3 UW Oshkosh 13-4-2 5-0
JW D3 Augsburg 8-8-1 5-5
TJ D2 Fort Lewis 23-1-0 Reserves (team carried 6 GK)
BS D2 Lewis College 16-3-3 Redshirt
WB NCJC D1 Garden City 15-4-0 15- NA
DF NCJC D1 Barton County 20-3-0 19-0
RG NCJC D1 Dakota County 15-6-1 19- na
DS NCJC D1 Dakota County 15-6-1 19-na
Taking out the players not playing SSM Grads played in 66% of the games. MN Grad played in 70% of the games.
SSM Grads on a average had college game records of won 8.3 games, lost 7.9 games and tied 2.3 games. MN Grads on average won 11.5 games, lost 5.9 games and ties 1.7 games.
SSM Grads played in 66% of the games, MN Grads played in 70% of the games. Which maybe a meanless number, but because the GS number was missing so much I did not use it.
So, SSM has 14 players 12 played college soccer, 10 played D1, 2 played other divisions. MN had 17 players, 14 played, 2 played D1, 4 played D2, 6 D3, 1 NAIA, 4 NJCC.
Very impressive data collection. (Are those lists complete? I wouldn't know.)
So what I see, and what I'm not surprised by:
- over 75% of the SSM soccer grads played college soccer
- less than 1% of the MN soccer grads played college soccer
Years back, I was an exchange student in Carolina. I tried out for a select training program. I was clearly top 20, but I was told I didn't even make the top 40 because I was Minnesotan. That sucked. I lost that entire year of training at my level because of my hometown.
In soccer utopia, the better player should make the team.
lol 11:06
what's your point with the statistics?
11:06
No the list of 09 MN grads is not complete.
The list for SSM is complete and was pretty easy to figure out. The list for MN/MTA not quite so easy or easy to figure out, an may not be complete. None of those figures include Eden Prairie players, some of who were very good. I think there is one CDA player but missing the rest. The MTA players were listed on their web site, but I'm pretty sure it is not complete either.
Foot Baller how do you get 1% for MN? Are you taking the whole population of soccer players in MN verse the whole population of a college prep boarding school? Otherwise I would say 85% of SSM players are playing college soccer. 82% of the MTA players are playing college soccer (I am assuming they had a 18 player roster, 1 player graduates this year bring it down to 17) Of those 17, I could only find information on 15 of them, don't know who the other two are. Of those 15 one was red shirted, so I don't count him. I counted all the players that are rostered whether they played or not, as both SSM & MN would lose players stated to be playing college soccer. So...what was your point?
You were a exchange student in Carolina? Never heard of such a thing. I thought exchange students were generally from different countries, didn't realize the MN was considered a different country? Or were you a boarding school student in Carolina?
for what its worth regarding the stats, good job!! Thanks!!
So the bottom line, what does it all mean to everyone?? Kids are going to school, some to get a great education, others, time will tell.
Say thanks to my car mechanic. Nothing like sitting in Caribou Coffee waiting for a car to get fix, between the caffeine and hour or so with nothing to do. That is what you get.
I don't think the stats show any of us something we didn't already know. SSM provides a great education, which in turn allows them the opportunities to play college soccer. MN public school/Club need to figure out how to get their players the same opportunities. They obviously have the talent.
Something I did notice while collecting stats. MN only has about five out of the 17 that were minority students. Therefore, that doesn't account for all of the discrepancy. I did notice that many of the MN players are going to excellent schools that just are not D1. Many of those schools have excellent soccer programs as well.
Something else I notice but have not mentioned until now, Samuel Asante the forward super star from the SSM National team is playing NAIA for Lindsay Wilson and only getting some playing time. Lends some credence that NAIA has some very good soccer programs gear for the international players.
What I've noticed for years and what is apparently again proven by those lists and numbers:
Given the quantity of soccer players in MN, not nearly enough of them are playing college soccer.
- There is a high percentage of SSM players playing college soccer. Good for them.
- There is a low percentage of MN players playing college soccer. Shame on that.
I think a lot of that is due to the UofM not having a NCAA Men's team which at least would introduce our youth to higher level college soccer. Shame on Title IX.
I believe the lack of a Gopher team and the apparent loss of the Thunder will kill what little hope there was for soccer in MN.
Footballer
AGAIN, how are you getting your numbers? 85% and 1%??? First you cannot compare a state to a private prep school is like comparing apples to green beans. If you comparing MTA to SSM, 82% of MTA is playing college soccer and 85% of SSM is playing college soccer. If you’re saying that 85% of SSM is playing D1 soccer, you’re incorrect. Only 66% are playing D1 soccer. Granted compared to MTA who only has 11% playing D1 that does not look good. However as previously mention here that has more to do with academics than soccer ability. Those players were not recruited for their soccer skills; they were recruited for their academics. If you have good grades and are a premier player in MN you can probably play D1 soccer somewhere if you want. That is what SSM is proving.
this just in.......
85% of US Air Force graduates from last year are in flight school studying to be pilots
less that 1% of all other engineering graduates are in flight school.
SSM recruits players from all across USA, Canada and even from Europe. It's hard to compare a school like that to clubs in Minnesota who get players from one metro area.
It's apples and oranges.
In reality SSM should beat every team they ever play from Minnesota whether it's boys or girls teams.
8:39- I had never thought of it that way. You are very insightful. Shut your pie hole whiners.
8:39, were you on break at your second-shift job when you posted that insightful post, or had the third round of cocktails just kicked in?
2:31 has it: shut the pie hole.
6:41,
Seems that the truth and facts trouble you.
SSM does recruit nation wide and internationally yet fails to consistently beat top clubs who recruit from a single metro area.
Is it the coaching?
Truth and facts don't bother me at all.
"In reality SSM should beat every team they ever play from Minnesota whether it's boys or girls teams."
One of the beauties of soccer is that any team can beat any other team on any given day. Leeds United beat Man U last weekend in the FA Cup. By your standard, Man U is an abject failure since Leeds is two leagues below the P.L.
If nothing else, having SSM around seems to motivate you. And I have no issues with that.
i always love the super late night posts when folks let down their guard and their true colors come out. "shut your pie hole"? what is this third grade?
8:21,
We're not talking about professionals here. We're talking about a school that offers players scholarships worth $35K+ recruiting from coast to coast, in Canada and Europe competing against clubs who draw their players from a single metro area at best.
They have many more players receiving D1 scholarships yet still don't sweep the State Cup championships. What's wrong with that program?
Apples and oranges isn't even a good description.
It would be like Eden Prairie HS football team playing against Alabama yet SSM struggles to beat the top clubs in Minnesota.
I don't think the little general and his minions from SSM have much to brag about when it's put into perspective.
I think what most of this proves is that SSM is doing a good job educating some soccer players. MN/MTA seems to be doing a better job training their soccer players but is struggling to get their players the academics to make it to the next level.
I do agree with 9:32 post, comparing SSM loses to MTA at State Cup to Man U and Leeds is ridiculous. Leeds had everything to prove and was the underdog MTA has nothing to prove. If anything, SSM should be motivated to beat MTA. In the whole discussion I have never understood how SSM claims to be making MN better if they cannot beat their competition. If anything at this point, I would say that MN/MTA is making SSM better.
I honestly don't agree that education/academics has a huge impact on whether MN/MTA or SSM has greater D1 scholarship success (maybe a few kids). IMO, it has more to do with their setups. That's why kids go to SSM. It's one of the key things they brag about - so important it's one of the first pages in their soccer brochure. It's part of their full time coaches job descriptions and they work hard at contacting coaches and providing national exposure to their players. At MN/MTA, the coaches are part time and much of the responsibility and effort falls on the player and his family. So instead of a full-time coordinated team effort, it's more of a player here, player there hit-or-miss approach.
how can MTA help their players be better students? They're a soccer club not a school? LOL
Togo soccer team shot up a few players killed in big tournament in Africa. This could only happen in soccer.
Ex SSM, current Akron, future MLS player Teal Bunbury wins Herman Trophy...
So, let me get this straight- some are arguing that SSM is a failure because they don't "sweep the State Cup championships", and yet admits that "They have many more players receiving D1 scholarships..."
Hmmm, let's take a moment to reflect on what the players/parents are at SSM for? Maybe (just maybe) they are there to gain whatever it takes to receive a D1 scholarship? Maybe, it is an opportunity to receive a quality education which financially they could not afford without soccer?
Can we at least agree that IF the motivations listed above are the reason a player goes to SSM, they are indeed NOT a failure? Maybe some are willing to let your child have the USYSA State Cup Champion patch in exchange for the other benefits which they deem more important?
Fact is, many SSM players were in quality programs prior to enrolling at SSM (some were even State Cup Champions before).
One more thing to add to the above post-
I won't trade my kid's College Scholarship $$s for your kid's State Cup patch.
Sorry, I know it isn't for a State Cup Champion patch, but I thought this may give you an idea of the actual value of being a State Cup runner-up:
http://cgi.ebay.com/US-YOUTH-SOCCER-HAWAII-STATE-CUP-2008-MEDAL-W-RIBBON_W0QQitemZ320277523686QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUS_SM_Fan_Shop?hash=item4a92072ce6#ht_500wt_1376
Like 9:15, I'll keep the kid's scholarship. 9:32 can have the State Cup patch.
909 has solid points, finally a post that uses a rational thought process to make me reevaluate my position.
Good points and perspective.
9/1/10 1:17 PM --
It's being done by NOMADS.
Fact is, many SSM players were in quality programs prior to enrolling at SSM (some were even State Cup Champions before).
One was even from a USYSA National Championship team.
8/1/10 5:08 -
There were 2 lists posted above.
1. MN 09 Grads (18 players)
2. SSM 09 Grads (14 players)
18 players out of Minnesota's 2009 graduates who played soccer? That's not a lot of players. I would estimate that is less than 1%.
I have zero connection to SSM and I won't send my kids there, but I think what they do there is pretty cool and certainly harmless to my family.
Congrats to the Hermann Trophy winner. That's awesome. First Minnesota player ever, I believe.
Minnesota soccer parents and players should be grateful for an academy like SSM close by. It gives us all opportunities to put our teams up against a very high level with players from across North America. I think the Minnesota teams appreciate that (and probably enjoy beating those teams). I was hopeful MTA would become something similar, but have instead created several teams at each level instead of focusing on one "elite" team. Their decision though.
However, what bothers me (and this is not SSM's fault) is that they have to participate in State Cup. Given the heightened advantage they have over the local clubs, it does make it exceedingly difficult for local clubs to win. With MRL spots and a chance to play at Regionals on the line, its an important title.
Again, not SSM's fault. They want to participate in MRL as well. As a coach who puts his team against SSM, would prefer they were doing something else beside a local tournament with kids from outside the state.
remember it's all about development.....lol.
They have the right to attempt to compete within the USYS National Championship Series. The first step of which is each State's State Cup. If not MN State Cup, where would you have them compete?
SSM has not, to date, been taking State Cup titles in every age group they compete in. I don't see any real unfair advantage that they have. Even though they recruit from all over, they are typically not pulling the best players that the United States has to offer. They get what they get, and typically the talent is fairly representative of every average player in every geographic location.
Yes, in the past, they occasionally have hit the jackpot with players. No need to name them here- however what have they got right now? The talent level is watered down- there is no Bunbury, Cline, or others to take their place.
Current teams are filled with typical hard-working Joe's. If they succeed with what they currently have it is because of coaching and work ethic. That's all.
No more bitching about "they *SHOULD* win". Fact is they AREN'T pulling players that clubs like PDA, Eclipse, the Texans, and such would miss. Facts are facts. If you get beat by them, you didn't work hard enough.
7:28 - fair enough. Bigger question - why not hitting the jackpot more often?
7:28,
Good point. Even the MTA White team beat them recently.
7:55- It is difficult to get the high quality players. The blue chip players aren't normally just "born". Most are in a quality situation with home club which has afforded them to be in a position that they don't feel the need to move away from home for a residential program. It is not a flaw with SSM, it is really the nature of the beast (especially in America).
In other countries you can lure many great players from their homes in the hopes of a better life. Where SSM appeals to people is the situation where there is an above average player with aspirations of taking their game to the next level but has no good club situation near them to get there. THIS is the reason that you get average/above average players at SSM. The theory from both parents and coaching staff is that they can transform those average players into the "blue chippers". Hasn't happened yet, but especially in the girls' side there has been no consistency in coaching (4 coaches in three years for the current U17s?). Until they fix problems at the top of the program, this will continue. If in doubt, ask anyone who has kids in the program on the girls' side.
The problem for SSM is that in order for the program to work, it has to bring in revenue (it is after all a business). There are two ways they can bring in this revenue:
1) More players who require less financial aid- which is difficult because few people who can afford the $40k (including "activity fee") have children that can really assist the program.
2) More money from benefactors of the school. This is difficult because they are not challenging for National Championships within the first three/four years. This is the real route they need to pursue in order to gain the revenue they need to keep going.
So, again the facts are:
SSM does recruit from essentially the World- but are not getting the pick of the litter. It is real work to get a player to move away from home. What you end up with is a better than average team because of facilities and frequency of training.
SSM has to participate in MN State Cup because it is the entry point to the USYS National Championship Series. They have a legal right to participate in this series, so the real moral issue is people who try and keep them out (actual law says that they cannot be denied participation, it is not just policy).
Wow! My kid got a soccer scholorship and a state cup patch last year. That with the money we saved by not sending him to SSM, college is now completely paid for. Life is good.
1031, I'm so happy for you!!
10:31, be proud of the MN State Cup Patch. I sure hope that isnt the pinnacle of your life.
8:15, GREAT Post!! The Igloo Clan has spoken.
SSM has a well-established hockey program that the SSM soccer program is trying to emulate. The hockey program sends a lot of kids to quality D1 schools.
But.... so does the MN high school system. It is regarded as the best US junior hockey state.
You guys are right it isn't the pinnacle of his life. The post was in response to Anon's 9:15 & 5:45 10/01/10 post. Please note in all of this I indicate him. In otherwords, he is paying for college, he has earned the state cup patch, he has earned his soccer scholorship and he is the one that will keep it. I'll not be keeping any soccer scholorships. Which is why it probably also won't be the pinnacle of his life.
SSM has every right and I don't think many actually are that upset about them being involved in the State Cup. Last year proved, that while they are competitive, so is the rest of MN.
My own personnel opinion is that if the SSM kids are not "blue chip" players or will not be making the regional pool, or have not made their own states ODP pool, they should not be place on MN ODP team. They can go thru the try outs, nothing saying they can't. As others here have labled them as marginal SSM players should not be taken over the marginal MN players. MN players will be going back to their home towns with the ODP experience and excitement while the SSM players will be going home to SC, IL, MI and those states will benefit from MN sacrifice. There nothing saying they can't go out for ODP, however their nothing saying we have to pick them. It is done throughout the country as someone else here already mentioned. It may not seem "fair" but life rarely is. If you are going to SSM and want to play on the MN ODP team you should be amongst the top 5 in the State to be safe or your familiy should be from MN and living in MN.
Also, if your focus is to get money for college do you really need to spend 40K a year to get a 25-30K year college education? Is it really about getting a college education or is about saying your playing D1 soccer. D1 soccer that looks maybe as good as any of the MIAC school. SSM parents you've obviously bought into the program and are hopefully happy with it. Understand thou that most of MN doesn't think that SSM is the answer to soccer in MN. SSM is a quality private boarding school that has a soccer and hockey program. Sending your son or daughter their will ensure they receive a quality education.
SSM are your attracting quality players as 11/1/10 9:28 AM is saying or is more like 12/1/10 8:15 AM. It seems as if they are claiming both.
Anon 11/1/10 7:28 PM please read this link. I would suspect very few of the players nor families can claim to be typical hard-working Joe's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Average_Joe
I have to agree with 8:31's post regarding SSM. I don't think that 1:33 has a clue how wrong they really are. I AM a parent of an SSM kid and nearly all my child's teammates come from a very similar income level as me- very middle of the road.
1:11 is errantly assuming that all kids at SSM are paying full tuition, when I would argue that most within the soccer program are not. So, for our family our expenditures have been well worth the scholarship which my child has earned.
1:27 both statements are true. Many did come from quality programs (win/loss wise). Just because a club has a good win/loss record doesn't mean it is the best place for development. I would argue that even though SSM doesn't typically have a stellar W/L record, the development and future of these players/students is very bright. That, my friends, is development.
Do I care if my kid's team wins State Cup? It would be nice, but I won't consider her time a failure if they don't win one. She left a perennial State Cup Champion team, that isn't important. NICE, but not important.
ODP- what can I say about that? My kid was on "our" State ODP team. She went to SSM only to be dumped immediately by her State team. Went from starter to not making the State pool. In three weeks time. Why? Because "she isn't here to train with the team". So, she is allowed to try out for MN ODP because she is IN Minnesota. If the players were 18, they could legally vote in MN elections. It is about the best, not the best of the rest. Either way, it makes no difference. If you don't like the eligibility rules contact USYS, state your case, and see if you can get it changed.
Anyone know anything about the Kings FC? I heard the tryout was a joke with a whole bunch of high school junior varsity talent. Do kids not want to play for free at the closest level to professional soccer?
I'm not sure but I would guess that most average joes don't attend private boarding school. High school average joes have part time jobs, live at home and go to public school. While attending private boarding school you may not be the best at judging what an average joe is.
You posted last year about your daughter not making your state ODP pool because of her choice to attend SSM. She and you obviously decided that what SSM could provide was better than being on your states ODP team. It seems like she made a choice. SSM over ODP.
Who said anything about changing eligibility rules. Just like the coaches from your home state, MN ODP coaches can make their selection based on any criteria they want.
The 40K was something Anon 12/1/10 8:15 AM posted. From the post I would assume they too are a SSM parent. So, perhaps more parents are paying that 40K than you realize.
If you could post the date of the Anon post your referring to it would help all of us follow your point. I'm still trying to figure out what 8:31 said.
10:25- It doesn't seem fair that to try and better her self, she had to give up another great program where she was doing well? But, it is what it is and she made the right decision.
I am not sure that you are entirely correct that MN ODP coaches can make their selection based on any criteria they want, I don't think it is in the intent of the ODP program to exclude based upon where the player's parents live. Much like it would be wrong to exclude based upon skin color, ethnic origin, or economic status. Or are you saying it is alright to discriminate in certain circumstances?
Remember, ODP is supposed to be about identifying the best players for support of Regional and National Teams. If this is the case, regardless of any demographics live the best players should be part of the pool.
$40k is nearly correct for full tuition and activity fee. Most of us don't talk too much about what each of us are paying, but you can certainly tell if someone has the means to pay full tuition. Even if simply because we all know each other and what each's occupation is. Kind of a no-brainer, really. Wouldn't you think?
My kid did have a part-time job (bagging groceries and carrying them to your car), and did go to public school. We are the epitomy of average joe, and I'll stand up next to the typical Suburban-ite Twin City dweller. By definition, I am not sure many of you are making anywhere near the $39k or whatever the wikipedia says is the average joe's income.
I got the time wrong, it was 8:15 that I agreed with. It was a logical and accurate post.
9:46,
Kids don't think about that. Even U18 players don't think about the coaching, the training opportunities, etc.
A kid wants to play:
- where their friends tell them to
- where their family tells them to
- where they have cool jerseys
ODP coaches obviously can make their selections based on whatever criteria they choose. Isn't that what your home town coaches did? Is it discrimination? I don't know, but when ODP coaches select an over abundance of players from their club, is that discrimination? Is it discrimination when an employer chooses an applicant who is from his alma mater? The players I'm talking about are the ones who will not be making the regional pool. They may not even be starters on the ODP team. For your daughter it sounds like she did make the right decision. If boundaries did not matter in ODP, I would think you could possible see the Wisconsin ODP team full of players from Illinois, Ohio South's team full of players from Ohio North and South and North Dakota full of players from Minnesota and Iowa. ODP has multiple objectives while identifying talent is one of the objectives; it is not the only objective goal.
I'm confused as to why you feel she needs the ODP program? Many MN players participate in MN ODP as means to be seen by college coaches. Something many here have already noted that boys in MN struggle with. It sounds to me like SSM is doing that for her already. Or is it something SSM pushes to help recruit more players? When I was at ODP camp not only did I see the SSM coaches recruiting heavily, but I saw the SSM players recruiting heavily.
The average median income in 2007 was 50,000 a year. Our family income is 65K, with all of us working. Both of my son's soccer teams have players on them whose families make significant less than either of those numbers. What you are failing to understand is that she is no longer bagging groceries or going to public school. Thus she is no longer an average Joe. One of issues with private boarding schools and gated communities is they isolate students and families. Their perception of average American is far different than reality. You may feel you are average, but I strongly suspect your family has very little in common with the average Joe any more.
If they already had try outs it seems a bit premature? If they looking to get some of the college players to play for free, I think that could happen however I think they need to get the college players home in order to have a try outs. Give it time.
7pm...Another great post. We are no longer at SSM, but we totally understand your post first hand.
The stats about 09 MN Boys is so way off their are more than the 18 listed playing College Soccer, check out the rosters of University of Wisconsin, Superior, Waldorf College NAIA, Clarke College, Grand View College, Jamestown College, and the list goes on..........
Post a Comment