if you are so willing to throw it out there, why not post your name? Stand up to your comments with a name if you really believe it. would love to hear who you are.
Sour grapes, either that, or you're looking for someting to hang your hate on. (Yes I said hate and not hat).
I too was at that game and do not have a daughter on either team. There were a couple of hard fouls, one was inexcusable the other, i think was an accident without intention.
What I saw, was two teams going hard at each other. It was a championship game between two teams that are rivals, what more do you expect?
I think you need to take a deep breath and maybe go watch a game or two at regionals or even nationals and get back to us.
As far as these teams being head and shoulders above the rest of the age group, that may be true, I'm not that familiar with the age group, but we'll see if the MTA team can compete at regionals. I hope they do well. I personally will root for any Minnesota team.
I think both teams have some talent, (a few players on each side seemed to stand out) but overall, they are not really that special.
It's time people get over their seething hatred for all things MTA. Why can't we just enjoy watching good soccer and wish them (and any team from Minnesota) well when they go out of town, not only to regionals, but tournaments across the country?
The comments you make are strong comments. I don't really know what you're talking about. I do remember the coach arguing one call, but tell me there's a coach out there that doesn't do that and I'll show you some ocean front land in Nebraska. Especially a coach who is trying to win a championship game. I don't know the coach, or even know his name, but I'd rather my daughter play for someone who actually cares enough to show some emotion than a coach who is just there to collect a pay check.
5:01 what are you saying? sounds like you are so soccer worldly that's great. your insinuation that i have not seen regional level soccer is off base but thanks for the lecture. i wish them (MTA 15) great success and all other MN teams at regionals, that is good for mn soccer and the champions deserve it. but success is more than just wins and losses as i am sure your world soccer travels have shown. my daughter is on a state cup winning team at a different age group so i will be at regionals in OH and i would expect support from the other MN teams. despite that i didnt see or hear the same antics in our games. then again i am just a dive instructor from nebraska. i appreciate the dis-agreement and different view of the game as that is what blogs are for (perspective). but you are off base when it comes to my naivete and that is beside the point. as for the coach comment, anger and hysterics are emotions too
I have a non state cup question that I am posting here because I know this thread gets a lot of attention. What age (if ever) is it ok for a player to miss her teams league game for an ODP camp ?
Please give me your honest thoughts on this. If you want to kick me out to another thread I understand but I am not sure any are really applicable.
If you kid makes ODP and wants to go to camp, she should. The coach should know when ODP camp is and move games away from those dates or realize that he/she will be missing players during that time. It is great that you kid makes the ODP team and should be able to attend camp if she wants to.
Yes, I know some of you are going to slam ODP and you have every right too. That is fine but it is up to the family to decide if ODP is important for their daughter.
I am not an ODP basher. I believe it definately has a place in the soccer world and in fact at certain times can be an effective program for the development and "showcasing" of an athlete. Here are my thoughts as it relates to when, and who should participate.
Age 13 and 14 go to your local clinics and get a feeling on how the program works. This however should NEVER interfere with your teams league games. In my opinion the lessons learned from playing with your team and putting your team first are FAR greater than anything you will learn by attending a local ODP camp. I also believe there is NO reason to attend the regional camp. It is very expensive and the value is low. Players who attend at the expense of their team are very often viewed as being selfish by the other players on the team. My opinion is for players at 13 and 14 to put your team first, make the regional pool , but decline on the camp.
U-15 mostly the same as above with a few exceptions. If you are that very good player who still chooses to play on a team below your ability because of the social aspects (play with friends) then you may want to go through the ODP program including the regional camp, to get yourself exposed to the "next level" of play. The ODP camp will allow that player a chance to see how they fit in at a higher level of play.
16+ go for it. At these ages kids are looking for exposure to college coaches and looking to play at the highest level possible.
I think too often young kids (parents) get caught up with the idea of ODP being the chance that they will be noticed as the next little Mia Hamm. I would urge all this age to learn the skills of the game by attending local camps that are far more affordable and just as effective. I firmly believe the youngers will benefit long term by learning to be a team mate first and an individual player second. Players who put the team ahead of themselves ironically very often become the best individual players. They are respected within their peer group because instinctively the kids on the team and in the league all know who really are the best players. This is my take on ODP. Youngers don't get too caught up, it really means nothing. Olders get involved. Mix it up with other like minded serious players.
5:33 - I appreciate your viewpoint. One question - you state "My opinion is for players at 13 and 14 to put your team first, make the regional pool , but decline on the camp". Did you mean the state pool? How do you make the regional pool without going to the regional camp?
5:33 may be correct in theory, but dead wrong in reality. ODP is so inertia driven that if you do not make it (for whatever reason) at 14/15 you have little shot at 16+.
ODP is becoming less of a factor as US Scoccer has implemented the many development academies throughout the US. ODP may still identify a player here or there but the academies are now the primary mode US Soccer is using to identify and develop players.
9:13 Yes, I am sorry I meant state pool. Then skip attending the regional camp. 9:41 Many U-14/15 are the same at U-16 but only because they are some of the best players. Several others are added right away at 16 who have not been in the ODP system because... they are very good players and often play on top teams where they have been pushed competitively everyday by good coaching and teammates who are of the same high level of play.
10:06, you are a cup is half-full apologist. In reality, the physical changes that occur from 13/14 to 16 are dramatic, but the familiar faces stay the same. While some of those familiar faces remain the best players, many others stay on simly by tying up their laces, and some stay on even without competing. The point is that if you want to make ODP at 16+, you really have to be there in your younger years unless you are head and shoulders better than the girls that were.
whats the point of ODP at 13 and 14? Revenue? I'v heard many say the clinics and training is marginal, and they almost always conflict with their team games and practices. If it is true that an exceptional player is excluded later in their soccer career because they didnt do it at 13 and 14, then that just proves it's a joke and stay away!
ODP is pretty much MTA kids anyway, so not sure why you'd do both. Top MTA teams get the same exposure as ODP, and MTA teams will show better (more consistent and cohesive) than the jumble of players thrown into positions in ODP.
I'd agree, having coached ODP and worked with MTA players I see no need for ODP IF..... If you're playing at a high level on your club team U13prem + and have a nationally licensed coach B, or A, then there's no need for ODP before u15, and then now with ECNL and US Development Academy, the regional competition is there for u13-u18 for boys and girls
If you're at a CC with a volunteer or unlicensed coach, then go to ODP, because that's what it was created for, so that those players can get exposure to national methodology, larger pools of players and regional competition and still stay with their club team
I know several players that have "walked in" at 15 and made the state team on their first time-they didn't make the regional team though.
The thing is, the regional pool is tougher to make for any Minnesota player primarily because of lack of coaching at younger ages, lack of quality competition in-state and daily at practice.
If you're lucky enough to have a nationally licensed coach C, B or A, at u11 or u12, u13 and you have great players at practice on a daily basis, then don't waste your money on ODP until 15 when the regional and national pool is a possibility.
The problem is most kids in the state still need ODP, but some of the best MTA players don't--which then dilutes the overall pool of state players and then MYSA takes everyone who shows a glimmer of potential. (I know one kid who made ODP, but wouldn't make MTA White for example)
I think MYSA needs to figure out how to make it better for MTA to get their players involved without recruiting issues at stake, but from my experience MTA can't control themselves when they're at the table.
I know ECNL clubs will be stepping away from State Cups, but is the same true for ODP? If so, that would pretty much take care of you MTA involvement issues. I know on the boys side with the USSF Academies, those players do not play in State Cups or participate in ODP.
Anonymous said... I have a non state cup question that I am posting here because I know this thread gets a lot of attention. What age (if ever) is it ok for a player to miss her teams league game for an ODP camp ?
Please give me your honest thoughts on this. If you want to kick me out to another thread I understand but I am not sure any are really applicable.
24/5/10 8:55 PM
The answer to this is not what club coaches want to hear...Its ok to miss a team event ANY time to do the next level event. You are NOT, repeat, NOT a pawn on your clubs team. You have to do what is right for your player. And if that means missing a league club game, then miss it. Remember, when you get to the recruiting age, college coaches are not there to recruit/scout a team, they are there to recruit/scout a player.
A team can make a player look good and bad and a coach may choose not to play a player because that is what is fair to rest of the group/team if he or she does not participate in scheduled team events.
As a result a player may be looked at in ODP but the next time a college watch a player it may be at the club level and it does not matter how good a player is if he or she is not on the field or if the rest of the team dont include that player.
Any player who think he or she is bigger than the team will never reach their full potential. There will always be a next level/new goals but a player will only reach them by playing and practicing with the team they are currently on.
With that said not that hard to avoid conflicts with a little planning and open communication.
12:11 - Great response!!! 11:15 - Wow- your kid is playing in the wrong sport...might I suggest Tennis or Golf. Those are individual sports where your DD can be recognized for her hard work. Last time I checked there were 11 players on a soccer field giving it a 100% (except for the kid who thought it was only about them and decided to "move to the next level"). That type of mentality is what is wrong in youth team sports. There is no "I" in TEAM!
Then why does ODP exist if not to identify INDIVIDUAL talent? I also know that most high level coaches here in MN enourage ODP involvement and are completely understanding if some kids miss a game or two as in the long run it makes them better players=better teammates=better teams. This whole discussion is classic "black-and-white" opinions although I believe most things in life are various shades of gray. One day we rip MN soccer for the kids not being "creative" and "lacking 1v1 skills" while the next day its "one for all" and "all for one". Watch the upcoming World Cup. See the teams that go far. Messi, Ronaldo, Rooney, Xavi, Kaka, Torres, etc..... Every single great athlete at some time in life had to make a conscious decision to excel on their own. Just IMO and I'm sure the purists will have a field day with this post.
11:15 - my daughter's coach has no problem with her missing a few practices here or there and actually hopes she goes to IL for the regional camp. i would suggest you run it by him/her. you might be surprised.
Interesting topic. Quick question for any coach out there to respond to: "Would you allow one of your players to miss practices/games to attend an ODP function (tryout, pool practice, regional camp, regional/national call-up, national team event like MN's had over the last few years)"?
I currently have four players in ODP, sure hope they all make it all the way.
All I ask for in return as with any other possible conflicts are communication.
So yes as a coach I would.
Another factor to consider is that as players get older league becomes less important. At the younger ages league and state is still considered important for various reasons.
4:22 First of all, all MTA players are involved in ODP, at least 1 of 2 players are MTA. A, B , C, who cares about licensures except wannabe , resume building posers. Can you coach soccer, can you coach kids, very often the later is totally disregarded. Give me a
354 - all those great, individually talented players make their teammates around them better. if individual talent is not achieving or understanding that concept, it is not worth having them around
All you have to do is peruse the player bios of any division 1 school and see how many players were ODP players - if your daughter has the potential and interest to play college ball then you have to take all opportunities to play ODP. And as someone on the thread said earlier - if you don't take the opportunity when the girls are younger they often don't get the opportunities when they are older. Being 'spotted' when you are 13-15 is the only way to make the Regional Team/National Team. Once the girls are in college, they have a whole different set of venues but at this age group - it is through ODP. For heaven's sake, girls miss parts of their college seasons to play on the national team - how is that so different?
How good a system can it be if kids are pigeon holed (in or out) of ODP at age 13? There are players at age 15-16 (that haven't been involved in ODP) that are better but the coaches don't want to be "wrong" about the ones they have picked (and no, I don't have kids involved).
I disagree about ODP. It has become very expensive, and at the younger age, borders on elitism (last year, for the 1997 boys, whoever was able to pay the money first got to attend the regional camp). My personal opinion is that the ID 2 program is much better. Coaches can recommend players, and if selected, the only expense is air fare. Once the player gets to camp, expenses are covered. Also, a key for ODP is having a State Coach that promotes your player and is well known in the soccer community. Again, just my perspective, but politics do play a role at the Regional Camps. If you have money and can afford it, great, but I think it is wise to look at options where the funds can be better spent (perhaps a camp at a school that your player wants to attend).
11:15 here....well, I disagree with your disagreement. My thought is, this is youth sport, these KIDS are not under any type of paid contracts. If one player is going to make a difference in a game or two, then the coach isnt doing a good enough job. And why is a win during some sort of league going to matter in the first place?? You said it, when a coach watches the next game. NEXT being the key word. Sorry Betty Joe, you cant go to ODP camp/session cuz we have a league game. Big freaking deal.
How many players that play 2 differnt sports, like basketball and soccer, and if there is a conflict, Im sure one of them are going to loose out right?? Same with ODP v Club. Wow, Landon, you cant go to Natl camp cuz the Galaxy has a game v NYRB. Now if the pros can do it, why cant a youth player?? A YOUTH PLAYER.
one more question, your all about the one for all, all for one thing, what did the team do for you to get into a top conference school?? Oh I guess its this way, I cant go to Univ of MN cuz all my teammates are going D2, D3, not playing. How many players today at U13 quit before U18?? Once some of these players hit HS, get a car, boy friend, jobs, etc, they totally forget about the soccer team. WoW, what about that one for all, all for one theory??
to answer part of your question 2:30, the reason that it is frowned upon for a youth player is because parents are involved. your kid can't excel on their own if my kids being left behind.
When I start making accusations against top level coaches, teenage girls, and parents, I will PROMISE to post my name. Since you have boldly done so, let's hear who you are.
The MTA club has already won 8 championships...1 more than last year. When the U19 girls win they will have 9 championships this year tying the highest number they ever achieved when they did that in 2008.
"ssssssssssssssssssssss" is the sound of a red hot club sizzling as they send 10 teams to regionals in Ohio.
5:52 Am - let's see how many come home from regionals with success. winning MN state champs is good and frankly they should given the fact they aggregate the best players in the state. but if they are truly moving up they will have success outside MN. i hope they do well for our state
9:24 - agreed, let's wish every club success at regionals. And before everyone starts ripping any team that does not perform well, I have yet to read any post or comment from any club/team stating that they will have success. They all hope for, are working hard for, aspire to do well, have club GOALS to be successful regionally/nationally, but I have yet to come across anything from anything stating they will not just hold their own but win. IMO, ripping teams at regionals for not performing well rings kind of hollow when it comes from folks who's teams are still here in MN.
I don't know how to put this, but I'm kind of a big deal, and I think the following teams will do well at regionals: SSM 18B, WDB 18G, SCV 16B, MTA 16G, MTA 14B, MTA 13B.
Burgandy, The WDB U18's have never done well so I doubt they will this year. SSM U18 boys have a chance because the best clubs are now in USDA and not playing in this event. SCV 16s have no chance. Our Minnesota talent is far too spread out at this age group even though the best teams from top clubs are playing in USDA. MTA 16s have proven they can compete at region level and might have a chance to advance. MTA U14s are talented but will struggle against the best from MI, OH and IL. MTA 13s are a terrific group who could surprise. They aren't big physically and could get muscled around by a bigger faster group of U13s. I do wish them all the best and hope we get a few teams through to Regions!
The MTA club has already won 8 championships...1 more than last year. When the U19 girls win they will have 9 championships this year tying the highest number they ever achieved when they did that in 2008.
"ssssssssssssssssssssss" is the sound of a red hot club sizzling as they send 10 teams to regionals in Ohio.
28/5/10 5:52 AM
ssssssssssss, dude, they havent won ANYTHING. MN State Cup, Wow. Go win a Natl Championship and we will talk.
2:41 - if they get out of a solid pool then you could make that argument. last year they went 2-1 in pool play and lost to the age group runner up (who lost to eclipse).
1:59, Guess what...you can't win at Regionals or Nationals if you don't win State Cup. Think before you say something stupid and stick that other foot in your mouth.
Prediction: Nothing major will be posted here from now until regionals (maybe a post or two re: US v/ England). Then the haters will thrash and bash the minute MTA gives up a goal at regionals.
I miss the WL Lighting!! Anyone know where some if any of the x-Lightning players are playing this summer?? K.Hood is playing pro in Norway. Any others??
Unfortunately for local college players the lighting team is not in WPSL this year and the closest WPSL teams are in Des Moines, the RUSH, comprised of ISU, Drake. and Univ. of IA. players, The next closest is Madison 56ers comprised of players from U of W , and local Madison players from various colleges. Each team is limited to 5players from same college. To my knowledge have found only one player from Minnesota playing in league besides a former SSM player Chelsa Kline playing on west coast team. Some local soccer interests should sponsor team next year. There is also FC Milw. amd Chicago Elcipse teams in league too. According to WPSL website the league is largest in the world and fifth toughest.
Quick check of Jennie Clark U of M not listed in any WPSL player list. What other leagues are there for college and post college players in adult level competitive womens leagues.
My thoughts on the girls pools (just my opinions so please don't shoot me): 13G: the MTA team is very talented, but will have their hands full with both MI and OS 14G: the EP team is a below average RII team with little regional success so will have their hands full with MI and MO (St. Louis) 15G: the MTA team is an slightly below average RII team and have a very difficult pool with IL and MI 16G: the MTA has always been good and if they don't win this pool they should get a new coach (NE, KY, & IA). They don't get much easier than this. 17G: the EP team is an above average RII team and drew a very tough pool with ON, OS & WI 18G: WDB is a very talented team, but drew I believe the defending champs (IL?) in their pool 19G: MTA has always been strong in their age group, but have no idea who's back from college on their team or any of the other teams.
As a whole, IMO, the girls teams ended up in pools that for the most part border on difficult with on most occassions two quality state representatives. Lots of MI, Il & Ohio's - traditionally more elite states. I would be happy if the combined w-l-t record is .500. If more than one team wins it's pool (U16G) then that would also be an accomplishment. Best of luck to all the teams!
Anonymous said... Quick check of Jennie Clark U of M not listed in any WPSL player list. What other leagues are there for college and post college players in adult level competitive womens leagues.
14/6/10 8:00 PM
She isnt playing in WPSL, she is with the WL team out in Jersey. Hudson Valley I think?? Good team. Is the WL team for Sky Blue.
if you've never cared for that team then they got smoked, if you are a fan of that team then it was expected, if you are like 99% of us then you probably don't have much of an opinion.
12:27 the MTA players, coaches and parents are just imitating or mimicking the behavior they observed from the other big clubs they play against like half blinded Eclipse club of Chicago and other self adsorbed programs in the USSF development academies teams, Midwest league and larger out state tournaments. This boorish behavior was and is further incubated from the culture of club and some primary members of organization past and present. Observed same traits years ago and left for lack of primary role models in organization despite some dedicated and astute MTA coaches who unfortunately exhibited the clubs lack of integrity in decision making handed down to them in money first organization. Daughters development and attitude as player and person actually improved after disconnecting from everything is due to MTA way of doing things. She continues to improve and knows that she is the primary person responsible for her image and improvement as player and person. And no she still plays and trains in league now above any MTA team has to offer. Strongly feel she has had greater success and self fulfillment than if she stayed in organization that continues to have some of primary purposes of sports participation skewed.
24/5/27 2:27 the MTA players, coaches and parents are just imitating or mimicking the behavior they observed from the other big clubs they play against like half blinded Eclipse club of Chicago and other self adsorbed programs in the USSF development academies teams, Midwest league and larger out state tournaments. This boorish behavior was and is further incubated from the culture of club and some primary members of organization past and present. Observed same traits years ago and left for lack of primary role models in organization despite some dedicated and astute MTA coaches who unfortunately exhibited the clubs lack of integrity in decision making handed down to them in money first organization. Daughters development and attitude as player and person actually improved after disconnecting from everything is due to MTA way of doing things. She continues to improve and knows that she is the primary person responsible for her image and improvement as player and person. And no she still plays and trains in league now above any MTA team has to offer. Strongly feel she has had greater success and self fulfillment than if she stayed in organization that continues to have some of primary purposes of sports participation skewed.
How is asking a question missing the point. Are you aware of a league above ECNL? I'm not, unless you are trying to say D1 or national team. I for one would like to hear the answer.
This blog endlessly has people making crap up, with no factual basis and you people blame any comment that doesn't agree with it on an MTA mentality.
Just because it is written doesn't mean it has any reality associated with it. It's bull, you don't even know the poster to be an MTA parent, player, or coach, yet you assume they are. Next, you'll blame it on SSM. Talk about boorish.
CC parent mentality is worse than MTA, SSM or any other ELITE level team I have ever seen.
no, 12:38, you're missing the point by assuming that a high-quality soccer experience can only be attained by playing at the highest level. 5:57 is saying his/her daughter is training at a higher level than at MTA. Many teams offer that opportunity, regardless of what league they play in.
ECNL is somewhat of a joke anyway, plus MTA somewhat stunk it up ECNL league play.
There are several leagues to play in summer months composed of college players and post college players and most are coached by A Licensed coaches. Their level of play and competition is higher than ECNL and at reasonable cost.
There are several leagues to play in composed of college and post college players most coached with A licensed coaches and at reasonable costs. The level of play is higher, faster and more physical than ECNL. MTA doesnt offer league entry because of implosion of former owner who displayed same character flaws that guided MTA officials.
2:17, I'm not missing the point, but you seem to know everyone elses thoughts and motivations. Oh that's right you don't, you just type in the crap.
I haven't said MTA is the end all be all, I simply asked what you think is a higher level of play (or training), but rather than answer you resort to your hate of MTA.
Again, just because you wrote down that there are A level coaches and better training, doesn't make it true. If you really know of these leagues and opportunities why is it that you refuse to name them so others can look into them and possibly joining??? If they exist in a secret closed world and only your daughter is allowed to play there just say so and none of us will bother you.
WDB formed a women's team made up of local college players that recently qualified for the 23 National Championships to be held in conjunction with the US Youth Soccer National Championship.
MTA is over rated? Unless my calculations are wrong the MTA Blue teams (boys & girls combined)record to this moment at Region 2 Championships is 12-7-1. When has a Minnesota club ever fared this well at Regions?
If 10:00am is referring to the U13 MTA girls, they are a very good team that lost to an even better team - Michigan Hawks (MI State Cup champs). They won their other two pool games beating the Ohio South State Cup champs today.
One of MTA'S most prominent coaches is being considered for an assistant coaching position with a USSF D2 team. This could eventually lead to the head coaching position.
As an old time soccer dad I think MN has inproved alot since my kids were playing. Back then it use to be good to get a win in pool play and now it looks like we have at least 3 or 4 teams going through to the next round. Congratulations to all the MN teams at Regions.
MTA Boys blue teams are 8-6 with 1 game to play. The wild card team lost all 3 games. Both boys and girls teams from MTA more successful than ever at regionals. They have 3 of their teams on to semi finals more than Minnesota has ever had.
Anonymous said... My thoughts on the girls pools (just my opinions so please don't shoot me): 13G: the MTA team is very talented, but will have their hands full with both MI and OS 14G: the EP team is a below average RII team with little regional success so will have their hands full with MI and MO (St. Louis) 15G: the MTA team is a slightly below average RII team and have a very difficult pool with IL and MI 16G: the MTA has always been good and if they don't win this pool they should get a new coach (NE, KY, & IA). They don't get much easier than this. 17G: the EP team is an above average RII team and drew a very tough pool with ON, OS & WI 18G: WDB is a very talented team, but drew I believe the defending champs (IL?) in their pool 19G: MTA has always been strong in their age group, but have no idea who's back from college on their team or any of the other teams.
As a whole, IMO, the girls teams ended up in pools that for the most part border on difficult with on most occassions two quality state representatives. Lots of MI, Il & Ohio's - traditionally more elite states. I would be happy if the combined w-l-t record is .500. If more than one team wins it's pool (U16G) then that would also be an accomplishment. Best of luck to all the teams!
15/6/10 11:48 AM
Not too bad. Congrats to all the participants - especially based on what was a very difficult draw and good luck to the two teams that made it to the regional semi-finals!
BTW a few shots taken at the MTA 13's . They had a very strong pool. The 16's however had perhaps the easiest pool possible. Iowa,SD, and KY. Good luck today in the semis, the competition will certainly firm up today.
Pretty good 9:15, but not rocket science. All the girls teams had tough draws this year. I disagree about the 16s. You don't have an easy bracket with a past region champ (Toro, NE) with you.
13s - probably went out to the eventual champs.
14s - no surprise they got killed. Not enough talent to compete at this level.
15s - no chance with the current coaching level and they need some talent consolidation.
16s - congrats. Win this morning and they go to nationals automatically, assuming NSA advances in the other semi.
17s - tough group. Need talent consolidation here for this age group to be competitive.
18s - similar draw to the 16s with two easy teams and a powerhouse. However, more difficult 3rd opponent with the nat champs in their group.
19s - tough draw but very good team who wants to win it all.
Boys did great overall.
13s - no chance against Sockers in game one.
14s - heartbreak. Defeated defending champs, lost the final game 2-4 after going up 2-0.
15s - easiest draw of all the MN teams. Congrats
16s - had a chance and were in it until the final group game.
17s - killer free kick in the 90th minute and own goal in the 91th minute in game number 2 against defending reg champs sent them home.
Yes - that is the same team Bangu Tsunami team that won at U13, however, is this the same Toro team currently ranked #19th in RII and came in 5th in MRL? We're happy that team won something two years ago, but they have done nothing since and that's a team you should have and rightly did beat. Best of luck to all the teams today and hopefully tomorrow.
9:13 - Nothing since? They were regional semi-finalists and finished 5th in the top level of the ECNL, and just this morning became the youngest team in MN history to qualify for nationals. But that's probably not good enough for you. Shows what MN's most academy-like system can produce. Oh wait, MA/MC/MTA don't develop players. They just raid other clubs who have done all the development work. Right. This group was in the system from 9 years old. The 19s also, and they're doing pretty well. So were Woodbury's 18s. Again, they're doing pretty well at a regional level.
When you open your eyes a bit you'll realize that high level player development in MN is on the upswing, regardless of how people like you criticize the MTA system.
My apologies. I didn't read it that way. Thanks for the clarification. Guess my post will be in preface to the posts to follow that will bash that 16 team :-)
I am confused also. Isn't it just the 4 region champs that go to nationals? Have they watered that down too? How would MTA advance if they do not win tomorrow?
The Chicago team came in second place in the "National League" and earned a spot to Nationals. There are 6 teams that go to Nationals, the top two from the National League and the four regional winners. Since Chicago NSA Fury already has their spot, it goes to the other finalist, which happens to be the U16 MTA team. Both teams tomorrow will be playing for the Region II title, so it should be a great battle. They tied 0-0 last year at regionals.
I looked at the U16 ECNL standings and see MTA finished 6'th. I don't see the NSA team listed at all. Mustang SC and Stars of Mass took top two spots. Still don't understand how NSA Fury already has a spot? Is there another league? http://www.clubsoccer.us/TTResults.aspx?tid=ECNL&year=2009&div=U16F01
Nat League is a USYS league I believe. ECNL is a US Club sanctioned league. Since Nationals is a USYS event, I suppose that they can dictate that the winner of their national league joins the region winners to fight for the national championship.
Come on folks, let's all get up to speed. There are websites for Region II and MRL and even the US national teams. Each also has articles about the leagues, Regionals, and Nationals.
The national league is comprised of very high level teams, played like MRL but over the winter months. Win or place and you get a spot at national cup. Just like winning MRL premier gets you a spot at regionals.
11:30 AM Minnesota soccer continues to improve. 10 years ago we were happy just to get a few goals at Regions. Congrats to all the teams on their showing at Region 2 Championships.
Thought u-18 inferno do better with additon coaching support , they actually didnt do any better same team they lost at disney after better December performance to another 2-0 loss in regions. Perhaps self anointed one should have left team alone. A "A" licensed coach could have possibily made a true difference. Great effort by team and very tough luck draw for bracket. Agree with earlier comments U-18 team has far more talent than U-17 unit at regions.
29/6/10:17 A.M. pretty fair evaluation and accessment of girls side and needs for positive improvements after regions. Biggest disappointment had to be U-17 group. Do agree more consolidation of talent in age group is needed. Afraid it not going to happen with current decision makers and likely rerun again next year. This is age group that won region 2 ODP championship with and should do better if most talented players in age group were allowed to play together rather than picked by coach answering to parents wishes. The players know who are best players to help team. Looks like another year of wasted and unmotivated training goals for next year U-18 potential division 1recruits in that age group.
The U17 age group should have consolidated a year ago. Unfortunate that they didn't. They all had a great chance to play in the ECNL and play for a coach who has taken teams to the nationals championship game on more than one occasion. Maybe they'll see the light and get together and have a real chance to succeed next year. Time will tell.
Nice attempt to excuse another poor performance, but it is way wide of the mark. If they didn't care, they wouldn't put all that time (and money) into it. For most players, when they are on the pitch at regions, soccer is life.
6:35, consolidation may not be the answer. This year EP added lots of "top" players from other clubs, including Wayzata. EP ended up third in a pool won by Ohio Elite. Last year, Wayzata did not recruit and finished third in its pool, tied with Ohio Elite.
Consolidation is not EP and Wayzata. Consolidation is the top players from the entire metro area. Many of whom play at EP, many of whom play at MTA. Merge those two teams for the core group, add in another from outside the two clubs here and there, and you have a team that will put MN's top female talent at that age group in the competitive mix.
I have to agree with the previous comments that it is unlikely we'll see consolidation at this age group, but it would be fun to see what this age group could achieve if they did find a way to consolidate. Regardless of your perspective on ECNL and DS vs. JE, it's clear that these two teams are headed in different directions. According to gotsoccer.com EP has moved up to being ranked 4th in the region and 34th nationally, while MTA has fallen to 34th in the region and 214th nationally. While MTA won state cup many years in a row when they were younger, they haven't made it to the finals either of the past two years while EP has made it to the finals both years.
Aren't a lot of these U17 girls committed to play in college? Are the college coaches encouraging them to consolidate to gain a higher level of play during their final prep year for college?
MA has already turned down a Tech Dir position with a Dev Acad club. This is the second MLS group that has courted him, USYS year long ban and all, to lead their youth development system. Not much left for him to accomplish here in MN anyways.
Germany is awesome. Spain is awesome. It will be a great semifinal.
What happened to the MTA U16 Silver team this year. They are at the bottom of the standings and will be regulated. Last year was the prediction that the 3 C1 teams that moved up would be at the bottom of the barrel. Anyone in the know?
Well, it should 10:08. Be passionate about the game at every level and in any environment. Your thinking/attitude is hindering the development of US youth soccer.
Maplebrook is relegated after Woodbury won the relegation bowl 2-0.
Which brings up this question...If only one team from a seven team league is relegated, does that mean no C1 team is promoted for next year?
If that's the case, MTA is to blame for removing any incentive from the C1 champs at state this year. They insisted on being placed in that league and once again, MYSA gives in to the demands of the evil empire.
The site is getting a little stale need change of topics so interject some current reading material for coaches, players and supportive parents in book recommendation just finished..... What Really Separates World-Class Performers from Everybody Else” by Geoff Colvin. Reason I enjoyed this book so much and hold it in high regard is simple . Throughout his narrative, Colvin inserts clusters of insights and recommendations that literally anyone can consider and then act upon to improve her or his individual performance as well as helping to improve the performance of a team of which she or he is a member. For example:
1. Attributes of deliberate practice (Pages 66-72) 2. What top performers perceive that others do not notice (Pages 89-94) 3. Benefits of having a "rich mental model"(Pages 123-124) 4. Rules for peak performance that "elite" organizations follow (Pages 128-136) 5. Misconceptions about innovation and creativity (Pages 149-151) 6. How innovators become great (Pages 159-161) 7. How to make organizations innovative (Pages 162-166) 8. What homes can teach organizations (Pages 172-175) 9. The "drivers" of great performance (Pages 187-193) 10. How some organizations "blow it" (Pages 194-1980) please am not MTA Hater no emails HAVE FUN READING AND GOOD LUCK IN IMPROVING THE GAME for all the players in upcoming high school and college season that share in common their commitment to continuous self-improvement through deliberate practice substantially, even if it isn't world-class. Remember Talent is overrated if it is perceived to be the most important factor. It isn't. In fact, talent does not exist unless and until it is developed...and the only way to develop it is (you guessed it) with deliberate practice. A few players are prodigies but most were late-bloomers and each followed a significantly different process of development. Share in common WITH THE WORLD CLASS PERFORMERS their commitment to continuous self-improvement through deliberate practice.
There are at least 10 of the 16 player from DS U17 team that have committed to Division 1 schools. EP has at least 3. DS is a better coach and has his girls where they need to be for the future.
Right....and DS hopefully can get that team next year to the state cup semi finals. Am sure all those 16 players will be really motivated to work hard individually to improve their weaknesses that kept them from advancing out of their bracket this year. It certainly makes that task easier having 10 players knowing where their going to college.
766 comments:
«Oldest ‹Older 601 – 766 of 766if you are so willing to throw it out there, why not post your name? Stand up to your comments with a name if you really believe it. would love to hear who you are.
921,
I'm not sure of the timeline (I think a couple yers from now) but the MTA ECNL teams will not be taking part in State Cup at U15, U16, and U17.
1227/341,
Sour grapes, either that, or you're looking for someting to hang your hate on. (Yes I said hate and not hat).
I too was at that game and do not have a daughter on either team. There were a couple of hard fouls, one was inexcusable the other, i think was an accident without intention.
What I saw, was two teams going hard at each other. It was a championship game between two teams that are rivals, what more do you expect?
I think you need to take a deep breath and maybe go watch a game or two at regionals or even nationals and get back to us.
As far as these teams being head and shoulders above the rest of the age group, that may be true, I'm not that familiar with the age group, but we'll see if the MTA team can compete at regionals. I hope they do well. I personally will root for any Minnesota team.
I think both teams have some talent, (a few players on each side seemed to stand out) but overall, they are not really that special.
It's time people get over their seething hatred for all things MTA. Why can't we just enjoy watching good soccer and wish them (and any team from Minnesota) well when they go out of town, not only to regionals, but tournaments across the country?
The comments you make are strong comments. I don't really know what you're talking about. I do remember the coach arguing one call, but tell me there's a coach out there that doesn't do that and I'll show you some ocean front land in Nebraska. Especially a coach who is trying to win a championship game. I don't know the coach, or even know his name, but I'd rather my daughter play for someone who actually cares enough to show some emotion than a coach who is just there to collect a pay check.
5:01 what are you saying? sounds like you are so soccer worldly that's great. your insinuation that i have not seen regional level soccer is off base but thanks for the lecture. i wish them (MTA 15) great success and all other MN teams at regionals, that is good for mn soccer and the champions deserve it. but success is more than just wins and losses as i am sure your world soccer travels have shown. my daughter is on a state cup winning team at a different age group so i will be at regionals in OH and i would expect support from the other MN teams. despite that i didnt see or hear the same antics in our games. then again i am just a dive instructor from nebraska. i appreciate the dis-agreement and different view of the game as that is what blogs are for (perspective). but you are off base when it comes to my naivete and that is beside the point. as for the coach comment, anger and hysterics are emotions too
I have a non state cup question that I am posting here because I know this thread gets a lot of attention.
What age (if ever) is it ok for a player to miss her teams league game for an ODP camp ?
Please give me your honest thoughts on this. If you want to kick me out to another thread I understand but I am not sure any are really applicable.
Never
Never
ALways
If you kid makes ODP and wants to go to camp, she should. The coach should know when ODP camp is and move games away from those dates or realize that he/she will be missing players during that time. It is great that you kid makes the ODP team and should be able to attend camp if she wants to.
Yes, I know some of you are going to slam ODP and you have every right too. That is fine but it is up to the family to decide if ODP is important for their daughter.
I am not an ODP basher. I believe it definately has a place in the soccer world and in fact at certain times can be an effective program for the development and "showcasing" of an athlete.
Here are my thoughts as it relates to when, and who should participate.
Age 13 and 14 go to your local clinics and get a feeling on how the program works. This however should NEVER interfere with your teams league games. In my opinion the lessons learned from playing with your team and putting your team first are FAR greater than anything you will learn by attending a local ODP camp. I also believe there is NO reason to attend the regional camp. It is very expensive and the value is low. Players who attend at the expense of their team are very often viewed as being selfish by the other players on the team. My opinion is for players at 13 and 14 to put your team first, make the regional pool , but decline on the camp.
U-15 mostly the same as above with a few exceptions. If you are that very good player who still chooses to play on a team below your ability because of the social aspects (play with friends) then you may want to go through the ODP program including the regional camp, to get yourself exposed to the "next level" of play. The ODP camp will allow that player a chance to see how they fit in at a higher level of play.
16+ go for it. At these ages kids are looking for exposure to college coaches and looking to play at the highest level possible.
I think too often young kids (parents) get caught up with the idea of ODP being the chance that they will be noticed as the next little Mia Hamm. I would urge all this age to learn the skills of the game by attending local camps that are far more affordable and just as effective. I firmly believe the youngers will benefit long term by learning to be a team mate first and an individual player second. Players who put the team ahead of themselves ironically very often become the best individual players. They are respected within their peer group because instinctively the kids on the team and in the league all know who really are the best players.
This is my take on ODP. Youngers don't get too caught up, it really means nothing. Olders get involved. Mix it up with other like minded serious players.
5:33 - I appreciate your viewpoint. One question - you state "My opinion is for players at 13 and 14 to put your team first, make the regional pool , but decline on the camp". Did you mean the state pool? How do you make the regional pool without going to the regional camp?
533, what is your background?
Thanks
5:33 may be correct in theory, but dead wrong in reality. ODP is so inertia driven that if you do not make it (for whatever reason) at 14/15 you have little shot at 16+.
ODP is becoming less of a factor as US Scoccer has implemented the many development academies throughout the US.
ODP may still identify a player here or there but the academies are now the primary mode US Soccer is using to identify and develop players.
9:13 Yes, I am sorry I meant state pool. Then skip attending the regional camp.
9:41 Many U-14/15 are the same at U-16 but only because they are some of the best players. Several others are added right away at 16 who have not been in the ODP system because... they are very good players and often play on top teams where they have been pushed competitively everyday by good coaching and teammates who are of the same high level of play.
10:06, you are a cup is half-full apologist. In reality, the physical changes that occur from 13/14 to 16 are dramatic, but the familiar faces stay the same. While some of those familiar faces remain the best players, many others stay on simly by tying up their laces, and some stay on even without competing. The point is that if you want to make ODP at 16+, you really have to be there in your younger years unless you are head and shoulders better than the girls that were.
whats the point of ODP at 13 and 14? Revenue? I'v heard many say the clinics and training is marginal, and they almost always conflict with their team games and practices. If it is true that an exceptional player is excluded later in their soccer career because they didnt do it at 13 and 14, then that just proves it's a joke and stay away!
ODP is pretty much MTA kids anyway, so not sure why you'd do both. Top MTA teams get the same exposure as ODP, and MTA teams will show better (more consistent and cohesive) than the jumble of players thrown into positions in ODP.
I'd agree, having coached ODP and worked with MTA players I see no need for ODP IF..... If you're playing at a high level on your club team U13prem + and have a nationally licensed coach B, or A, then there's no need for ODP before u15, and then now with ECNL and US Development Academy, the regional competition is there for u13-u18 for boys and girls
If you're at a CC with a volunteer or unlicensed coach, then go to ODP, because that's what it was created for, so that those players can get exposure to national methodology, larger pools of players and regional competition and still stay with their club team
I know several players that have "walked in" at 15 and made the state team on their first time-they didn't make the regional team though.
The thing is, the regional pool is tougher to make for any Minnesota player primarily because of lack of coaching at younger ages, lack of quality competition in-state and daily at practice.
If you're lucky enough to have a nationally licensed coach C, B or A, at u11 or u12, u13 and you have great players at practice on a daily basis, then don't waste your money on ODP until 15 when the regional and national pool is a possibility.
The problem is most kids in the state still need ODP, but some of the best MTA players don't--which then dilutes the overall pool of state players and then MYSA takes everyone who shows a glimmer of potential. (I know one kid who made ODP, but wouldn't make MTA White for example)
I think MYSA needs to figure out how to make it better for MTA to get their players involved without recruiting issues at stake, but from my experience MTA can't control themselves when they're at the table.
I know ECNL clubs will be stepping away from State Cups, but is the same true for ODP? If so, that would pretty much take care of you MTA involvement issues.
I know on the boys side with the USSF Academies, those players do not play in State Cups or participate in ODP.
u13 and you have great players at practice on a daily basis, then don't waste your money
ha ha great and daily, get off your delusioned bus!
Anonymous said...
I have a non state cup question that I am posting here because I know this thread gets a lot of attention.
What age (if ever) is it ok for a player to miss her teams league game for an ODP camp ?
Please give me your honest thoughts on this. If you want to kick me out to another thread I understand but I am not sure any are really applicable.
24/5/10 8:55 PM
The answer to this is not what club coaches want to hear...Its ok to miss a team event ANY time to do the next level event. You are NOT, repeat, NOT a pawn on your clubs team. You have to do what is right for your player. And if that means missing a league club game, then miss it. Remember, when you get to the recruiting age, college coaches are not there to recruit/scout a team, they are there to recruit/scout a player.
Disagree with 11:15am
A team can make a player look good and bad and a coach may choose not to play a player because that is what is fair to rest of the group/team if he or she does not participate in scheduled team events.
As a result a player may be looked at in ODP but the next time a college watch a player it may be at the club level and it does not matter how good a player is if he or she is not on the field or if the rest of the team dont include that player.
Any player who think he or she is bigger than the team will never reach their full potential. There will always be a next level/new goals but a player will only reach them by playing and practicing with the team they are currently on.
With that said not that hard to avoid conflicts with a little planning and open communication.
well stated 12:11
nothing worse than a group of 11 individuals all wearing the same uniform of one team but not playing as a team
SSM 17B proved that.
12:11 - Great response!!!
11:15 - Wow- your kid is playing in the wrong sport...might I suggest Tennis or Golf. Those are individual sports where your DD can be recognized for her hard work. Last time I checked there were 11 players on a soccer field giving it a 100% (except for the kid who thought it was only about them and decided to "move to the next level"). That type of mentality is what is wrong in youth team sports. There is no "I" in TEAM!
or, as Clem Haskins once eloquently stated, "There is no 'I' in Minnesota." Actually, there is. He must not have been tutored by Ms. Ganglehoff.
Sadly, I think 11:15 would come back with, "There is no 'TEAM' without ME' "
Then why does ODP exist if not to identify INDIVIDUAL talent? I also know that most high level coaches here in MN enourage ODP involvement and are completely understanding if some kids miss a game or two as in the long run it makes them better players=better teammates=better teams.
This whole discussion is classic "black-and-white" opinions although I believe most things in life are various shades of gray.
One day we rip MN soccer for the kids not being "creative" and "lacking 1v1 skills" while the next day its "one for all" and "all for one".
Watch the upcoming World Cup. See the teams that go far. Messi, Ronaldo, Rooney, Xavi, Kaka, Torres, etc.....
Every single great athlete at some time in life had to make a conscious decision to excel on their own. Just IMO and I'm sure the purists will have a field day with this post.
11:15 - my daughter's coach has no problem with her missing a few practices here or there and actually hopes she goes to IL for the regional camp. i would suggest you run it by him/her. you might be surprised.
Interesting topic.
Quick question for any coach out there to respond to:
"Would you allow one of your players to miss practices/games to attend an ODP function (tryout, pool practice, regional camp, regional/national call-up, national team event like MN's had over the last few years)"?
I posted the 12:11 post
I currently have four players in ODP, sure hope they all make it all the way.
All I ask for in return as with any other possible conflicts are communication.
So yes as a coach I would.
Another factor to consider is that as players get older league becomes less important. At the younger ages league and state is still considered important for various reasons.
4:22
First of all, all MTA players are involved in ODP, at least 1 of 2 players are MTA. A, B , C, who cares about licensures except wannabe , resume building posers. Can you coach soccer, can you coach kids, very often the later is totally disregarded. Give me a
354 - all those great, individually talented players make their teammates around them better. if individual talent is not achieving or understanding that concept, it is not worth having them around
All you have to do is peruse the player bios of any division 1 school and see how many players were ODP players - if your daughter has the potential and interest to play college ball then you have to take all opportunities to play ODP. And as someone on the thread said earlier - if you don't take the opportunity when the girls are younger they often don't get the opportunities when they are older. Being 'spotted' when you are 13-15 is the only way to make the Regional Team/National Team. Once the girls are in college, they have a whole different set of venues but at this age group - it is through ODP. For heaven's sake, girls miss parts of their college seasons to play on the national team - how is that so different?
How good a system can it be if kids are pigeon holed (in or out) of ODP at age 13? There are players at age 15-16 (that haven't been involved in ODP) that are better but the coaches don't want to be "wrong" about the ones they have picked (and no, I don't have kids involved).
9:32 - who says they are better?
You are making my point.
and what point is that?
I disagree about ODP. It has become very expensive, and at the younger age, borders on elitism (last year, for the 1997 boys, whoever was able to pay the money first got to attend the regional camp). My personal opinion is that the ID 2 program is much better. Coaches can recommend players, and if selected, the only expense is air fare. Once the player gets to camp, expenses are covered. Also, a key for ODP is having a State Coach that promotes your player and is well known in the soccer community. Again, just my perspective, but politics do play a role at the Regional Camps. If you have money and can afford it, great, but I think it is wise to look at options where the funds can be better spent (perhaps a camp at a school that your player wants to attend).
11:15 here....well, I disagree with your disagreement. My thought is, this is youth sport, these KIDS are not under any type of paid contracts. If one player is going to make a difference in a game or two, then the coach isnt doing a good enough job. And why is a win during some sort of league going to matter in the first place?? You said it, when a coach watches the next game. NEXT being the key word. Sorry Betty Joe, you cant go to ODP camp/session cuz we have a league game. Big freaking deal.
How many players that play 2 differnt sports, like basketball and soccer, and if there is a conflict, Im sure one of them are going to loose out right?? Same with ODP v Club. Wow, Landon, you cant go to Natl camp cuz the Galaxy has a game v NYRB. Now if the pros can do it, why cant a youth player?? A YOUTH PLAYER.
one more question, your all about the one for all, all for one thing, what did the team do for you to get into a top conference school?? Oh I guess its this way, I cant go to Univ of MN cuz all my teammates are going D2, D3, not playing. How many players today at U13 quit before U18?? Once some of these players hit HS, get a car, boy friend, jobs, etc, they totally forget about the soccer team. WoW, what about that one for all, all for one theory??
2:30, Well said!
24/5/10 4:01 PM -- You are so bold! Why don't you post your real name.
9:56 AM, you know better.
to answer part of your question 2:30, the reason that it is frowned upon for a youth player is because parents are involved. your kid can't excel on their own if my kids being left behind.
Take your medicine 3:23 and 3:25, relax, ohhhmmmmmm
no, i wont.
ssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
When I start making accusations against top level coaches, teenage girls, and parents, I will PROMISE to post my name. Since you have boldly done so, let's hear who you are.
10:18
Never such true words.
sssssssssssssssss
The MTA club has already won 8 championships...1 more than last year.
When the U19 girls win they will have 9 championships this year tying the highest number they ever achieved when they did that in 2008.
"ssssssssssssssssssssss" is the sound of a red hot club sizzling as they send 10 teams to regionals in Ohio.
Keep winning at all costs, MTA, it's good for the ego.
5:52 Am - let's see how many come home from regionals with success. winning MN state champs is good and frankly they should given the fact they aggregate the best players in the state. but if they are truly moving up they will have success outside MN. i hope they do well for our state
9:24 - agreed, let's wish every club success at regionals.
And before everyone starts ripping any team that does not perform well, I have yet to read any post or comment from any club/team stating that they will have success. They all hope for, are working hard for, aspire to do well, have club GOALS to be successful regionally/nationally, but I have yet to come across anything from anything stating they will not just hold their own but win.
IMO, ripping teams at regionals for not performing well rings kind of hollow when it comes from folks who's teams are still here in MN.
I don't know how to put this, but I'm kind of a big deal, and I think the following teams will do well at regionals: SSM 18B, WDB 18G, SCV 16B, MTA 16G, MTA 14B, MTA 13B.
Thanks Ron - good observations. IMO, lots more boys teams than girls teams due to the RII impact of the USSF DAP.
Burgandy,
The WDB U18's have never done well so I doubt they will this year.
SSM U18 boys have a chance because the best clubs are now in USDA and not playing in this event.
SCV 16s have no chance. Our Minnesota talent is far too spread out at this age group even though the best teams from top clubs are playing in USDA.
MTA 16s have proven they can compete at region level and might have a chance to advance.
MTA U14s are talented but will struggle against the best from MI, OH and IL.
MTA 13s are a terrific group who could surprise. They aren't big physically and could get muscled around by a bigger faster group of U13s.
I do wish them all the best and hope we get a few teams through to Regions!
Anonymous said...
sssssssssssssssss
The MTA club has already won 8 championships...1 more than last year.
When the U19 girls win they will have 9 championships this year tying the highest number they ever achieved when they did that in 2008.
"ssssssssssssssssssssss" is the sound of a red hot club sizzling as they send 10 teams to regionals in Ohio.
28/5/10 5:52 AM
ssssssssssss, dude, they havent won ANYTHING. MN State Cup, Wow. Go win a Natl Championship and we will talk.
1:59 - I believe all that 5:52 was doing was throwing it back in the face of "sssssssssssss" who lobbed out all those bombs over the past few weeks.
instead of sssssssssssssssssss it should be $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.
Dare I say WDB has better coaching this time?
P.S. I love lamp.
2:41 - if they get out of a solid pool then you could make that argument. last year they went 2-1 in pool play and lost to the age group runner up (who lost to eclipse).
1:59,
Guess what...you can't win at Regionals or Nationals if you don't win State Cup.
Think before you say something stupid and stick that other foot in your mouth.
so many words spoken by so many girls parents...but nothing said...
11:05 PM -- great contribution,NOT!!!
Prediction: Nothing major will be posted here from now until regionals (maybe a post or two re: US v/ England). Then the haters will thrash and bash the minute MTA gives up a goal at regionals.
157, Give it a rest!!
1:57 speaks the truth. Just watch.
I miss the WL Lighting!! Anyone know where some if any of the x-Lightning players are playing this summer?? K.Hood is playing pro in Norway. Any others??
When is the
Where is the
Unfortunately for local college players the lighting team is not in WPSL this year and the closest WPSL teams are in Des Moines, the RUSH, comprised of ISU, Drake. and Univ. of IA. players, The next closest is Madison 56ers comprised of players from U of W , and local Madison players from various colleges. Each team is limited to 5players from same college. To my knowledge have found only one player from Minnesota playing in league besides a former SSM player Chelsa Kline playing on west coast team. Some local soccer interests should sponsor team next year. There is also FC Milw. amd Chicago Elcipse teams in league too. According to WPSL website the league is largest in the world and fifth toughest.
brackets are out for regionals
ww.region2.com/assets/regionii_championships/2010%20BracketDraw%20for%20Posting%20June%2010.pdf
I think Jennie Clark from the U is playing in the WL with a team out east??
yawn. sorry, girls' soccer always makes me sleepy.
Quick check of Jennie Clark U of M not listed in any WPSL player list. What other leagues are there for college and post college players in adult level competitive womens leagues.
My thoughts on the girls pools (just my opinions so please don't shoot me):
13G: the MTA team is very talented, but will have their hands full with both MI and OS
14G: the EP team is a below average RII team with little regional success so will have their hands full with MI and MO (St. Louis)
15G: the MTA team is an slightly below average RII team and have a very difficult pool with IL and MI
16G: the MTA has always been good and if they don't win this pool they should get a new coach (NE, KY, & IA). They don't get much easier than this.
17G: the EP team is an above average RII team and drew a very tough pool with ON, OS & WI
18G: WDB is a very talented team, but drew I believe the defending champs (IL?) in their pool
19G: MTA has always been strong in their age group, but have no idea who's back from college on their team or any of the other teams.
As a whole, IMO, the girls teams ended up in pools that for the most part border on difficult with on most occassions two quality state representatives. Lots of MI, Il & Ohio's - traditionally more elite states. I would be happy if the combined w-l-t record is .500. If more than one team wins it's pool (U16G) then that would also be an accomplishment.
Best of luck to all the teams!
Anonymous said...
Quick check of Jennie Clark U of M not listed in any WPSL player list. What other leagues are there for college and post college players in adult level competitive womens leagues.
14/6/10 8:00 PM
She isnt playing in WPSL, she is with the WL team out in Jersey. Hudson Valley I think?? Good team. Is the WL team for Sky Blue.
WDB 18G got smoked (6-1) by SCV 16B in a scrimmage last week. Surprising or expected?
if you've never cared for that team then they got smoked, if you are a fan of that team then it was expected, if you are like 99% of us then you probably don't have much of an opinion.
12:27 the MTA players, coaches and parents are just imitating or mimicking the behavior they observed from the other big clubs they play against like half blinded Eclipse club of Chicago and other self adsorbed programs in the USSF development academies teams, Midwest league and larger out state tournaments. This boorish behavior was and is further incubated from the culture of club and some primary members of organization past and present. Observed same traits years ago and left for lack of primary role models in organization despite some dedicated and astute MTA coaches who unfortunately exhibited the clubs lack of integrity in decision making handed down to them in money first organization. Daughters development and attitude as player and person actually improved after disconnecting from everything is due to MTA way of doing things. She continues to improve and knows that she is the primary person responsible for her image and improvement as player and person. And no she still plays and trains in league now above any MTA team has to offer. Strongly feel she has had greater success and self fulfillment than if she stayed in organization that continues to have some of primary purposes of sports participation skewed.
24/5/27 2:27 the MTA players, coaches and parents are just imitating or mimicking the behavior they observed from the other big clubs they play against like half blinded Eclipse club of Chicago and other self adsorbed programs in the USSF development academies teams, Midwest league and larger out state tournaments. This boorish behavior was and is further incubated from the culture of club and some primary members of organization past and present. Observed same traits years ago and left for lack of primary role models in organization despite some dedicated and astute MTA coaches who unfortunately exhibited the clubs lack of integrity in decision making handed down to them in money first organization. Daughters development and attitude as player and person actually improved after disconnecting from everything is due to MTA way of doing things. She continues to improve and knows that she is the primary person responsible for her image and improvement as player and person. And no she still plays and trains in league now above any MTA team has to offer. Strongly feel she has had greater success and self fulfillment than if she stayed in organization that continues to have some of primary purposes of sports participation skewed.
She plays in a league higher than ECNL.... what would that be??
You're missing the point, 7:12, which simply reinforces 5:57's point about the whacked out priorities at MTA.
How is asking a question missing the point. Are you aware of a league above ECNL? I'm not, unless you are trying to say D1 or national team. I for one would like to hear the answer.
This blog endlessly has people making crap up, with no factual basis and you people blame any comment that doesn't agree with it on an MTA mentality.
Just because it is written doesn't mean it has any reality associated with it. It's bull, you don't even know the poster to be an MTA parent, player, or coach, yet you assume they are. Next, you'll blame it on SSM. Talk about boorish.
CC parent mentality is worse than MTA, SSM or any other ELITE level team I have ever seen.
Hey I wrote that down, it is now true fact!
no, 12:38, you're missing the point by assuming that a high-quality soccer experience can only be attained by playing at the highest level. 5:57 is saying his/her daughter is training at a higher level than at MTA. Many teams offer that opportunity, regardless of what league they play in.
ECNL is somewhat of a joke anyway, plus MTA somewhat stunk it up ECNL league play.
2:17 - since you seem to have an insight into 5:57's thinking, maybe you can define what they mean by "higher level"?
There are several leagues to play in summer months composed of college players and post college players and most are coached by A Licensed coaches. Their level of play and competition is higher than ECNL and at reasonable cost.
There are several leagues to play in composed of college and post college players most coached with A licensed coaches and at reasonable costs. The level of play is higher, faster and more physical than ECNL. MTA doesnt offer league entry because of implosion of former owner who displayed same character flaws that guided MTA officials.
and the names of these leagues are......
boy, 10:23, you've had TOO MUCH of the Kool-Aid. There....just....can't....be....another....MTA....alternative.
what's that smell?
2:17, I'm not missing the point, but you seem to know everyone elses thoughts and motivations. Oh that's right you don't, you just type in the crap.
I haven't said MTA is the end all be all, I simply asked what you think is a higher level of play (or training), but rather than answer you resort to your hate of MTA.
Again, just because you wrote down that there are A level coaches and better training, doesn't make it true. If you really know of these leagues and opportunities why is it that you refuse to name them so others can look into them and possibly joining??? If they exist in a secret closed world and only your daughter is allowed to play there just say so and none of us will bother you.
go away 12:42. "I'm not saying MTA is the end all," you're just thinking it.
What's that smell?
WDB formed a women's team made up of local college players that recently qualified for the 23 National Championships to be held in conjunction with the US Youth Soccer National Championship.
U18 Woodbury won 7 0
U16 MTA won 1 0
U13 MTA lost 0 2
U17 EP lost 1 4
13,14,15,17 lose at Regions
First Day winners:
16 MTA Blue
18 Inferno
19 MTA Blue
13 MTA is overrated
MTA is over rated?
Unless my calculations are wrong the MTA Blue teams (boys & girls combined)record to this moment at Region 2 Championships is 12-7-1.
When has a Minnesota club ever fared this well at Regions?
If 10:00am is referring to the U13 MTA girls, they are a very good team that lost to an even better team - Michigan Hawks (MI State Cup champs). They won their other two pool games beating the Ohio South State Cup champs today.
MTA U16 girls swept all 3 games in bracket play and are in semis starting tomorrow.
One of MTA'S most prominent coaches is being considered for an assistant coaching position with a USSF D2 team. This could eventually lead to the head coaching position.
As an old time soccer dad I think MN has inproved alot since my kids were playing. Back then it use to be good to get a win in pool play and now it looks like we have at least 3 or 4 teams going through to the next round. Congratulations to all the MN teams at Regions.
MTA boys are 8-9-0 with one game to play. MTA girls are 7-4-1. Girls rocked; boys didn't.
MTA Boys blue teams are 8-6 with 1 game to play. The wild card team lost all 3 games.
Both boys and girls teams from MTA more successful than ever at regionals.
They have 3 of their teams on to semi finals more than Minnesota has ever had.
Congrats to MTA16 and MTA19 girls and MTA15 and SSM18 boys. Good luck in tomorrows semis.
Anonymous said...
My thoughts on the girls pools (just my opinions so please don't shoot me):
13G: the MTA team is very talented, but will have their hands full with both MI and OS
14G: the EP team is a below average RII team with little regional success so will have their hands full with MI and MO (St. Louis)
15G: the MTA team is a slightly below average RII team and have a very difficult pool with IL and MI
16G: the MTA has always been good and if they don't win this pool they should get a new coach (NE, KY, & IA). They don't get much easier than this.
17G: the EP team is an above average RII team and drew a very tough pool with ON, OS & WI
18G: WDB is a very talented team, but drew I believe the defending champs (IL?) in their pool
19G: MTA has always been strong in their age group, but have no idea who's back from college on their team or any of the other teams.
As a whole, IMO, the girls teams ended up in pools that for the most part border on difficult with on most occassions two quality state representatives. Lots of MI, Il & Ohio's - traditionally more elite states. I would be happy if the combined w-l-t record is .500. If more than one team wins it's pool (U16G) then that would also be an accomplishment.
Best of luck to all the teams!
15/6/10 11:48 AM
Not too bad. Congrats to all the participants - especially based on what was a very difficult draw and good luck to the two teams that made it to the regional semi-finals!
So the MTA wild card team doesn't count in the MTA standings? I bet they would have had they gone 3-0! Oh, that's right...they're just a Wings team.
Congrats to all teams who got through pool play.
BTW a few shots taken at the MTA 13's . They had a very strong pool. The 16's however had perhaps the easiest pool possible. Iowa,SD, and KY. Good luck today in the semis, the competition will certainly firm up today.
Pretty good 9:15, but not rocket science. All the girls teams had tough draws this year. I disagree about the 16s. You don't have an easy bracket with a past region champ (Toro, NE) with you.
13s - probably went out to the eventual champs.
14s - no surprise they got killed. Not enough talent to compete at this level.
15s - no chance with the current coaching level and they need some talent consolidation.
16s - congrats. Win this morning and they go to nationals automatically, assuming NSA advances in the other semi.
17s - tough group. Need talent consolidation here for this age group to be competitive.
18s - similar draw to the 16s with two easy teams and a powerhouse. However, more difficult 3rd opponent with the nat champs in their group.
19s - tough draw but very good team who wants to win it all.
Boys did great overall.
13s - no chance against Sockers in game one.
14s - heartbreak. Defeated defending champs, lost the final game 2-4 after going up 2-0.
15s - easiest draw of all the MN teams. Congrats
16s - had a chance and were in it until the final group game.
17s - killer free kick in the 90th minute and own goal in the 91th minute in game number 2 against defending reg champs sent them home.
18s - SSM should win it all
19s - average.
Is the current MTA U16 girls team the same age group that won Region Championship a few years back at U13?
7:11 - excellent summary but what will be done by MTA to correct the issues with consolidation and coaching?
Yes - that is the same team Bangu Tsunami team that won at U13, however, is this the same Toro team currently ranked #19th in RII and came in 5th in MRL? We're happy that team won something two years ago, but they have done nothing since and that's a team you should have and rightly did beat.
Best of luck to all the teams today and hopefully tomorrow.
7:11 clarification: U18s had two tough teams (both past Regional Champs, one the Nat'l Champ) and one easy team in pool.
U16 girls win in overtime. See you in Kansas.
9:13 - Nothing since? They were regional semi-finalists and finished 5th in the top level of the ECNL, and just this morning became the youngest team in MN history to qualify for nationals. But that's probably not good enough for you. Shows what MN's most academy-like system can produce. Oh wait, MA/MC/MTA don't develop players. They just raid other clubs who have done all the development work. Right. This group was in the system from 9 years old. The 19s also, and they're doing pretty well. So were Woodbury's 18s. Again, they're doing pretty well at a regional level.
When you open your eyes a bit you'll realize that high level player development in MN is on the upswing, regardless of how people like you criticize the MTA system.
9:13 here, take a deep breathe 10:58, I was talking about the NE team which had not done much since......
Congrats to the MTA U16 team.
My apologies. I didn't read it that way. Thanks for the clarification. Guess my post will be in preface to the posts to follow that will bash that 16 team :-)
1054, don't they have to win the game against the Chicago team to see who goes to Nationals? I'm a little confused.
Re: consolidation and coaching, MTA has successfully made consolidation work. Just imagine the results we'll see when they get the coaching to match.
I am confused also. Isn't it just the 4 region champs that go to nationals? Have they watered that down too? How would MTA advance if they do not win tomorrow?
The Chicago team came in second place in the "National League" and earned a spot to Nationals. There are 6 teams that go to Nationals, the top two from the National League and the four regional winners. Since Chicago NSA Fury already has their spot, it goes to the other finalist, which happens to be the U16 MTA team. Both teams tomorrow will be playing for the Region II title, so it should be a great battle. They tied 0-0 last year at regionals.
What is the national league.
12:46,
Who should they hire to coach?
I looked at the U16 ECNL standings and see MTA finished 6'th. I don't see the NSA team listed at all. Mustang SC and Stars of Mass took top two spots. Still don't understand how NSA Fury already has a spot? Is there another league?
http://www.clubsoccer.us/TTResults.aspx?tid=ECNL&year=2009&div=U16F01
Nat League is a USYS league I believe. ECNL is a US Club sanctioned league. Since Nationals is a USYS event, I suppose that they can dictate that the winner of their national league joins the region winners to fight for the national championship.
http://www.usyouthsoccer.org/national_league/gamecenter.asp?SEASON=2010&AGE_GROUP=G-U16
Come on folks, let's all get up to speed. There are websites for Region II and MRL and even the US national teams. Each also has articles about the leagues, Regionals, and Nationals.
The national league is comprised of very high level teams, played like MRL but over the winter months. Win or place and you get a spot at national cup. Just like winning MRL premier gets you a spot at regionals.
MTA 16 lose 3-0 in final.
MTA 19 lose in semifinal on PK's after 2-2 tie thru OT.
WDB 18 goes 2-1 with 2-0 loss
MTA 13 goes 2-1 with 2-0 loss
Every one of these teams was knocked out by the eventual region champ.
Good job girls!
11:30 AM
Minnesota soccer continues to improve. 10 years ago we were happy just to get a few goals at Regions.
Congrats to all the teams on their showing at Region 2 Championships.
Thought u-18 inferno do better with additon coaching support , they actually didnt do any better same team they lost at disney after better December performance to another 2-0 loss in regions. Perhaps self anointed one should have left team alone. A "A" licensed coach could have possibily made a true difference. Great effort by team and very tough luck draw for bracket. Agree with earlier comments U-18 team has far more talent than U-17 unit at regions.
11:30AM - MA is a very proud man today.
29/6/10:17 A.M. pretty fair evaluation and accessment of girls side and needs for positive improvements after regions. Biggest disappointment had to be U-17 group. Do agree more consolidation of talent in age group is needed. Afraid it not going to happen with current decision makers and likely rerun again next year. This is age group that won region 2 ODP championship with and should do better if most talented players in age group were allowed to play together rather than picked by coach answering to parents wishes. The players know who are best players to help team. Looks like another year of wasted and unmotivated training goals for next year U-18 potential division 1recruits in that age group.
same one bitter parent - same one bitter rant.
The U17 age group should have consolidated a year ago. Unfortunate that they didn't.
They all had a great chance to play in the ECNL and play for a coach who has taken teams to the nationals championship game on more than one occasion.
Maybe they'll see the light and get together and have a real chance to succeed next year.
Time will tell.
Same one bitter parent - same one bitter rant.
maybe they don't care. life is bigger than soccer.
maybe they don't care. life is bigger than soccer.
Nice attempt to excuse another poor performance, but it is way wide of the mark. If they didn't care, they wouldn't put all that time (and money) into it. For most players, when they are on the pitch at regions, soccer is life.
6:35, consolidation may not be the answer. This year EP added lots of "top" players from other clubs, including Wayzata. EP ended up third in a pool won by Ohio Elite. Last year, Wayzata did not recruit and finished third in its pool, tied with Ohio Elite.
Consolidation is not EP and Wayzata. Consolidation is the top players from the entire metro area. Many of whom play at EP, many of whom play at MTA. Merge those two teams for the core group, add in another from outside the two clubs here and there, and you have a team that will put MN's top female talent at that age group in the competitive mix.
The issue you have is that the EP parents can't get over the MTA thing and the MTA kids will not play for JE when they can play for DS.
I have to agree with the previous comments that it is unlikely we'll see consolidation at this age group, but it would be fun to see what this age group could achieve if they did find a way to consolidate. Regardless of your perspective on ECNL and DS vs. JE, it's clear that these two teams are headed in different directions. According to gotsoccer.com EP has moved up to being ranked 4th in the region and 34th nationally, while MTA has fallen to 34th in the region and 214th nationally. While MTA won state cup many years in a row when they were younger, they haven't made it to the finals either of the past two years while EP has made it to the finals both years.
Aren't a lot of these U17 girls committed to play in college? Are the college coaches encouraging them to consolidate to gain a higher level of play during their final prep year for college?
MA off to join his buddy Amos Magee in Portland? Any truth to the rumor? Who is coaching MTA 14s,15s and 16s next year?
MA off to join his buddy Amos Magee in Portland? Any truth to the rumor? Who is coaching MTA 14s,15s and 16s next year?
From the other thread:
MA has already turned down a Tech Dir position with a Dev Acad club. This is the second MLS group that has courted him, USYS year long ban and all, to lead their youth development system. Not much left for him to accomplish here in MN anyways.
Germany is awesome. Spain is awesome. It will be a great semifinal.
except maybe win a regional or national championship?
What happened to the MTA U16 Silver team this year. They are at the bottom of the standings and will be regulated. Last year was the prediction that the 3 C1 teams that moved up would be at the bottom of the barrel. Anyone in the know?
or a high school championship.
As if that mattters to a soccer coach (except for the dinosaurs).
Well, it should 10:08. Be passionate about the game at every level and in any environment. Your thinking/attitude is hindering the development of US youth soccer.
Anyone hear a score for U15 girls premier game between Woodbury and Maplebrook?
Maplebrook is relegated after Woodbury won the relegation bowl 2-0.
Which brings up this question...If only one team from a seven team league is relegated, does that mean no C1 team is promoted for next year?
If that's the case, MTA is to blame for removing any incentive from the C1 champs at state this year. They insisted on being placed in that league and once again, MYSA gives in to the demands of the evil empire.
6:08 your ignorance, laziness, and hate are showing.
Go to the MYSA site and look up your own answer or continue being a victim.
Do yo really need Premier status to feel good about your team? Your ego shouldn't be the issue in your kid's sports.
9:43 am Spoken like a true MTA elitist pig.
you know people just can't control themselves when they are having the same argument on two separate threads on the same blog......
11:24 AM you would know, ding-dong!
who runs this blog anyway???!!
BQ, though he will never admit it
The site is getting a little stale need change of topics so interject some current reading material for coaches, players and supportive parents in book recommendation just finished..... What Really Separates World-Class Performers from Everybody Else” by Geoff Colvin. Reason I enjoyed this book so much and hold it in high regard is simple . Throughout his narrative, Colvin inserts clusters of insights and recommendations that literally anyone can consider and then act upon to improve her or his individual performance as well as helping to improve the performance of a team of which she or he is a member. For example:
1. Attributes of deliberate practice (Pages 66-72)
2. What top performers perceive that others do not notice (Pages 89-94)
3. Benefits of having a "rich mental model"(Pages 123-124)
4. Rules for peak performance that "elite" organizations follow (Pages 128-136)
5. Misconceptions about innovation and creativity (Pages 149-151)
6. How innovators become great (Pages 159-161)
7. How to make organizations innovative (Pages 162-166)
8. What homes can teach organizations (Pages 172-175)
9. The "drivers" of great performance (Pages 187-193)
10. How some organizations "blow it" (Pages 194-1980) please am not MTA Hater no emails
HAVE FUN READING AND GOOD LUCK IN IMPROVING THE GAME for all the players in upcoming high school and college season that share in common their commitment to continuous self-improvement through deliberate practice substantially, even if it isn't world-class. Remember Talent is overrated if it is perceived to be the most important factor. It isn't. In fact, talent does not exist unless and until it is developed...and the only way to develop it is (you guessed it) with deliberate practice. A few players are prodigies but most were late-bloomers and each followed a significantly different process of development. Share in common WITH THE WORLD CLASS PERFORMERS their commitment to continuous self-improvement through deliberate practice.
There are at least 10 of the 16 player from DS U17 team that have committed to Division 1 schools. EP has at least 3. DS is a better coach and has his girls where they need to be for the future.
1012 - good recommendation, thank you!
Right....and DS hopefully can get that team next year to the state cup semi finals. Am sure all those 16 players will be really motivated to work hard individually to improve their weaknesses that kept them from advancing out of their bracket this year. It certainly makes that task easier having 10 players knowing where their going to college.
this one too.
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